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Thanx alot!
It get so personal and intence when it´s translated. Fasinating! Does the memorial tell us what Cohort or Legion he was a member of?
biarchus decanus, what does biarchus stand for?
Numerus Scutatorum? Many shields! Is that heavy infantery?
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has the original poster disappeared into the eternal darkness of the germanic forests?
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Maybe, maybe not. The original post is pre-RAT v2. The transfer from v1 to v2 required RATers to reactivate their accounts and email addresses. Those accounts whose owners didn't do that, were deleted after 6 months.
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So far, this is all I could find about ranks below the century-level
"Contubernium.— This was the name given under the empire to the body of soldiers who were quartered together in the same tent; the captain of the mess, decanus or decurio, is called by Vegetius caput contubernii, and Ammianus designates the mess-mates by the word concorporales."
That comes from...
http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/R ... citus.html
There a lot more there, but my Latin is very rusty. Maybe someone with better translator skills can get more out of it.
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One last time...
There's this entry from Roman-Empire.net
http://www.roman-empire.net/army/contubernalis.html
"The Contubernalis was the first man of an eight man contubernium unit. A normal soldier without command he was most likely in charge of various tent or barracks duties."
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Slightly OT here, but I have often wondered whether I am correct in thinking that the word 'contabernium' could be broken up into 'con' + 'tabernium', with 'tabernium' being simply a room or cubicle and the 'con' indicating it is where you were with your fellow mess mates. I have generally assumed that 'tabernium' was the root word for both 'tabernacle' and 'tavern'. Am I correct in this or have I been off on a flight of fantasy for several years?
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Quote:"The Contubernalis was the first man of an eight man contubernium unit. A normal soldier without command he was most likely in charge of various tent or barracks duties."
Hi Cedric,
I'm very tempted to say that there is no evidence and that a contubernalis is simply a synonym for simple soldier, or comrade, similar to gregalis, (co)manipularis, etc.
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Quote:Slightly OT here, but I have often wondered whether I am correct in thinking that the word 'contabernium' could be broken up into 'con' + 'tabernium', with 'tabernium' being simply a room or cubicle and the 'con' indicating it is where you were with your fellow mess mates. I have generally assumed that 'tabernium' was the root word for both 'tabernacle' and 'tavern'. Am I correct in this or have I been off on a flight of fantasy for several years?
You're pretty much on track, O Crispe. W. Smith's entry for Contubernales in his Dictionary of Greek and Roman Antiquities gives a similar breakdown. Basically, it is representative of a relationship between individuals who are living under a common roof (be it canvas, goatskin, or wood ).
-Severus
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Quote:"The Contubernalis was the first man of an eight man contubernium unit. A normal soldier without command he was most likely in charge of various tent or barracks duties."
The same site (no longer a live link) says the same position is held by the decanus...so no clarity.
I have heard to the soldiers referred to as conterbernales, but not a single individual.
But as I have posted and searched for the last couple of hours regarding decurion/decanus trying to ascertain the name of the barracks/tent "head" its nice to know that the source is actually Vegetius and an 19th century book on Latin and Greek military terms, so at least I know where the idea came from, even if it is not ceratin it was a term used by 1st century Romans.
Phew :wink:
[/quote]
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Quote:I have heard to the soldiers referred to as conterbernales, but not a single individual.
How about (as an example) AE 1914, 102 (Apulum, Dacia):
D(is) M(anibus) / Mucatra / Brasi miles / n(umeri) Palmyren(orum) / vixit annis XXXVIIII / Mucapor Mucatral / heres contubern(ali) / carissimo posuit
"... His heir, Mucapor Mucatral, set this up for his dear contubernalis."
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[edit] High level ranks
Legatus Legionis/Primus Pilus: The overall Legionary commander. This post was generally appointed by the emperor, was a former Tribune and held command for 3 or 4 years, although could serve for a much longer period. In a province with only one legion, the Legatus was also the provincial governor and in provinces with multiple legions, each legion has a Legatus and the provincial governor has overall command of them all.
The Quaestor: Served as a type of quartermaster general, in charge of purchasing, finance, the collection and distribution of booty, etc. Again, these might perform similar functions on the civilian side.
The Legati: senior commanders under the supremo. Generally they were of senatorial rank and were commissioned by the Senate.
Tribunus Laticlavius: Named for the broad striped toga worn by men of senatorial rank. This tribune was appointed by the Emperor or the Senate. Though generally quite young and less experienced than the Tribuni Angusticlavii, he served as second in command of the legion, behind the Legate.
Praefectus Castrorum: The camp Prefect. Generally he was a long serving veteran who had been promoted through the ranks of the centurions and was 3rd in overall command.
Tribuni Angusticlavii: Each legion had 6 military tribunes of equestrian (knight) class citizens. They were in many cases career officers and served many of the important administrative tasks of the Legion, but still served in a full tactical command function during engagements.
[edit] Mid Level ranks
Primus Pilus: The senior centurion of the legion and commander of the first cohort was called the primus pilus ("first spear"), a career soldier and advisor to the legate. While every normal cohort was composed of 5 to 8 centuries, the one that was led by the primus pilus (the first) had about 10 centuries, or 800 men.
Pilus Prior: Senior centurion in any cohort other than the first cohort. Commanded that cohort and served as an advisor to the legion's commander.
Centurions: They were the backbone of the professional army and were the career soldiers who ran the day to day life of the soldiers as well as issuing commands in the field. They were generally moved up from the ranks, but in some cases could be direct appointments from the Emperor or other higher ranking officials. There were 64 centurions in each legion (10 in the first cohort and 6 in the rest), one to command each centuria of the 10 cohorts. The ranking of centurions were: Pilus Prior, Pilus Posterior, Princepes Prior, Princepes Posterior, Hastatus Prior, and Hastatus Posterior. The Prior centurion of each pair commanded the maniple.
Aquilifer: A single position within the Legion. The aquilifer was the Legion's Standard or Eagle bearer and was an enormously important and prestigious position. The next step up would be a post as a centurion.
Optio: One for each centurion (therefore, there were 64 in a legion), they were appointed by the centurion from within the ranks to act as his second in command.
Tesserarius: (Guard Commander) Again there were 64 of these, or one for each centuria. They acted in similar roles to the optiones.
Signifer: Each centuria had a signifer (therefore, there were 64 in a legion). He was responsible for the men's pay and savings, and the standard bearer for the Centurial Signum, a spear shaft decorated with medallions and often topped with an open hand to signify the oath of loyalty taken by the soldiers. It was this banner that the men from each individual centuria would rally around. A soldier could also gain the position of Discentes signiferorum, or standard bearer in training.
Cornicen: (Horn blower) They worked hand in hand with the signifer drawing the attention of the men to the Centurial Signum and issuing the audible commands of the officers.
Imaginifer: Carried the Standard bearing the image of the Emperor as a constant reminder of the troop's loyalty to him.
Low level ranks
Legionarii: The basic soldiers of a Legion, who were well trained fighters and received roughly the same pay as Immunes.
Immunes: These were trained specialists, such as surgeons, engineers, surveyors, and architects, as well as craftsmen. They were exempt from camp and hard labor duties due to the nature of their work, and would generally earn slightly more pay than the Milites.
Discentes: Milites in training for an immunis position.
Milites Gregarii: The basic private-level foot soldiers.
Tirones: The basic new private recruits. A Tironis could take up to 6 months before becoming a full Miles
Hi my name is johnathan :lol: <img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_lol.gif" alt=":lol:" title="Laughing" />:lol:
I would like to help as much as possible
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[edit] High level ranks
Legatus Legionis/Primus Pilus: The overall Legionary commander. This post was generally appointed by the emperor, was a former Tribune and held command for 3 or 4 years, although could serve for a much longer period. In a province with only one legion, the Legatus was also the provincial governor and in provinces with multiple legions, each legion has a Legatus and the provincial governor has overall command of them all.
The Quaestor: Served as a type of quartermaster general, in charge of purchasing, finance, the collection and distribution of booty, etc. Again, these might perform similar functions on the civilian side.
The Legati: senior commanders under the supremo. Generally they were of senatorial rank and were commissioned by the Senate.
Tribunus Laticlavius: Named for the broad striped toga worn by men of senatorial rank. This tribune was appointed by the Emperor or the Senate. Though generally quite young and less experienced than the Tribuni Angusticlavii, he served as second in command of the legion, behind the Legate.
Praefectus Castrorum: The camp Prefect. Generally he was a long serving veteran who had been promoted through the ranks of the centurions and was 3rd in overall command.
Tribuni Angusticlavii: Each legion had 6 military tribunes of equestrian (knight) class citizens. They were in many cases career officers and served many of the important administrative tasks of the Legion, but still served in a full tactical command function during engagements.
[edit] Mid Level ranks
Primus Pilus: The senior centurion of the legion and commander of the first cohort was called the primus pilus ("first spear"), a career soldier and advisor to the legate. While every normal cohort was composed of 5 to 8 centuries, the one that was led by the primus pilus (the first) had about 10 centuries, or 800 men.
Pilus Prior: Senior centurion in any cohort other than the first cohort. Commanded that cohort and served as an advisor to the legion's commander.
Centurions: They were the backbone of the professional army and were the career soldiers who ran the day to day life of the soldiers as well as issuing commands in the field. They were generally moved up from the ranks, but in some cases could be direct appointments from the Emperor or other higher ranking officials. There were 64 centurions in each legion (10 in the first cohort and 6 in the rest), one to command each centuria of the 10 cohorts. The ranking of centurions were: Pilus Prior, Pilus Posterior, Princepes Prior, Princepes Posterior, Hastatus Prior, and Hastatus Posterior. The Prior centurion of each pair commanded the maniple.
Aquilifer: A single position within the Legion. The aquilifer was the Legion's Standard or Eagle bearer and was an enormously important and prestigious position. The next step up would be a post as a centurion.
Optio: One for each centurion (therefore, there were 64 in a legion), they were appointed by the centurion from within the ranks to act as his second in command.
Tesserarius: (Guard Commander) Again there were 64 of these, or one for each centuria. They acted in similar roles to the optiones.
Signifer: Each centuria had a signifer (therefore, there were 64 in a legion). He was responsible for the men's pay and savings, and the standard bearer for the Centurial Signum, a spear shaft decorated with medallions and often topped with an open hand to signify the oath of loyalty taken by the soldiers. It was this banner that the men from each individual centuria would rally around. A soldier could also gain the position of Discentes signiferorum, or standard bearer in training.
Cornicen: (Horn blower) They worked hand in hand with the signifer drawing the attention of the men to the Centurial Signum and issuing the audible commands of the officers.
Imaginifer: Carried the Standard bearing the image of the Emperor as a constant reminder of the troop's loyalty to him.
Low level ranks
Legionarii: The basic soldiers of a Legion, who were well trained fighters and received roughly the same pay as Immunes.
Immunes: These were trained specialists, such as surgeons, engineers, surveyors, and architects, as well as craftsmen. They were exempt from camp and hard labor duties due to the nature of their work, and would generally earn slightly more pay than the Milites.
Discentes: Milites in training for an immunis position.
Milites Gregarii: The basic private-level foot soldiers.
Tirones: The basic new private recruits. A Tironis could take up to 6 months before becoming a full Miles
Hi my name is johnathan :lol: <img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_lol.gif" alt=":lol:" title="Laughing" />:lol:
I would like to help as much as possible
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Ah, Wikipedia again? I don't think it will help, really.
Quote:[edit] High level ranks
Legatus Legionis/Primus Pilus: The overall Legionary commander.
The Legatus and the primus pilus were NOT the same thing, by a long shot! The Legatus was a senator appointed by the Emperor (during the Empire, that is!), while the primus pilus was the senior centurion, either promoted up through the ranks, or having been appointed directly to the centurionate from the equestrian class by a provincial governor and then risen up through that.
Quote: The Legati: senior commanders under the supremo.
What's a "supremo"?
Quote:Primus Pilus: The senior centurion of the legion and commander of the first cohort was called the primus pilus ("first spear")...
NO! It means "First FILE". The word "pilus" is NOT the same word as "pilum" (which in any case means a javelin and not a spear).
Quote:While every normal cohort was composed of 5 to 8 centuries, the one that was led by the primus pilus (the first) had about 10 centuries, or 800 men.
No, the first cohort had FIVE double-sized centuries, so only 5 centurions. (And 5 optiones, etc.) This is well-attested in literature. I guess this is why the rest of this strange article keeps saying "64 centuries", etc.
Jonathan, sorry if this looks like I'm going to a lot of effort to shred everything you post, but I really think you need to be shown how flawed your information is. When a discussion such as this one is filled with pages of good research and documentation, there is no point in posting such basic and erroneous stuff as this. Just trying to save you some grief.
Matthew
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