Crenellations and the Castra Praetoria

[Arahne]

I suppose that I follow you corectly. There are no foundations built, but living rock? So we have building without foundations, or I am seriously missing something here?
I have measured from the level that I thought is concrete (stone, mortar)foundation. Not from the modern level.
Building phases - one building phase for me is when you achieve building goal, from the botom to the top, wheather it takes one month or 10 years nevermind. It is one building phase. Next phase is when somebody uses finished building with different changes in respect to the new needs that he adapts the building to.
Do we agree about this?
Right now I have tried to find somethin about CP in Landers and Petrikovits monographies but it is intresting that there are no comments...
CP from some large ROme plan from 1975
http://s19.photobucket.com/albums/b169/ ... t=0017.jpg

[sulla felix]

Mike,

I thought the coins were interesting, but as you say depictions on Roman coins can be very stylisitic (out of necessity, since they have a very small "canvas" with which to work!).

I noticed that the walls were not depicted as smooth faced, although I suppose that a faux masonary effect could have been acheived within the plastering to the brick faced walls. Or are we seeing the bold painted red lines of the pseudo ashlar to which you referred earlier?

My first reaction upon seeing the coins was that we are looking at a flat topped curtain wall, but then I am not sure what the strange features are indicated in the box below. Are these apertures within the merlons themselves perhaps, with very small embrasures? Or are we just seeing builings within the flat topped curtain wall?




I note your comments about the marble veneer to brick facing, but could one infer from this that brick faced structures were actually quite common in Rome prior to Augustus' geat building programme and cultural renewal?

[Arahne]

D.Baatz gave the measures for embrasure and merlons 2.9 m and 0.6 m
http://ads.ahds.ac.uk/catalogue/adsdata ... 160001.pdf

[mcbishop]

D.Baatz gave the measures for embrasure and merlons 2.9 m and 0.6 m
http://ads.ahds.ac.uk/catalogue/adsdata ... 160001.pdf

Which reflects the traditional view of narrow merlons with wide gaps between them.

As for Barry's point about Augustus, it was more a sound-bite than a technical assessment, I suspect, but as there are no peg-holes for cladding and the CP was Tiberian in its first build, then it would logically have been rendered and painted, as per the coins... but then one thing archaeology teaches you is that you can't really base many arguments on coin evidence alone (whether it be dating or representations!).

Mike Bishop

[sulla felix]

As for Barry's point about Augustus, it was more a sound-bite than a technical assessment, I suspect, but as there are no peg-holes for cladding and the CP was Tiberian in its first build, then it would logically have been rendered and painted, as per the coins... but then one thing archaeology teaches you is that you can't really base many arguments on coin evidence alone (whether it be dating or representations!).

Yep that's me - all soundbites and no substance. I should run for PM. :lol:

I still cannot help thinking that a military fort (or for that matter a lot of other buildings) might not necessarily be plastered externally though.

[Arahne]

Only information that mentions building in sections I have found in Todd's work on Aurelian wall 4.5-6x1.3x1.8 m
http://ads.ahds.ac.uk/catalogue/library ... N=30191466
But interesting info on similar topic.
M.Mirkovic published inscription from SIrmium
Leg(io) XIII gem(ina) p(edes v(alli) c(entum)
which is thought to have took part in building northern wall in SIrmium
Mirkovic mentions two inscriptions CIL III 1980, CIL III 1979
where similar situation was recorded:
Building a part of wall in length of ..pedes CC...;... muri pedes DCCC (fecit) in his turr(is) una
Mirkovic, Arheoloski Vestnik 41, Ljubljana 1990.

[P. Clodius Secundus]

The long sections appear to be flush with the courses laid upon them. If they were filling in narrow embrasures why would the set them back from the existing face. The photshop version with the long merlons looks right, but that's probably because I've seen too many works from later periods. Being a "Trajan's is more right than wrong" kind of guy I've gotta say "narrow merlons/wide embrasures. Does anybody know the width of the wall walk and the depth/height of the parapets on the CP and other structures? Was there any change or trend dating from around AD 100?

[mcbishop]

For those who like staring at bricks (and I mean a lot of bricks) I have posted my photos (>200) of the Castra Praetoria taken during the summer onto Flickr together with the plan taken from my fortresses book.

You may find some of this useful when viewed in conjunction with Alexandra Busch's excellent study on the army in Rome.* You will hopefully already be aware of the databases of architectural fragments and gravestones that accompany the book.

Mike Bishop

*Busch, A. W. 2011: Militär in Rom. Militärische und paramilitärische Einheiten im kaiserzeitlichen Stadtbild, Palilia 20, Wiesbaden