Illerup Adal Swords

[marcos]

Hi everybody,
I recently saw images of the swords from the Illerup hoard in a book. I don't know the author so I assume he is quite serious and expert, but I indeed wonder the condition of the handle of those swords! I simply can't believe they are in such perfect shape, almost brand new.

[attachment=2115]00781.jpg[/attachment]

If you take a look, wodden pommels are quite shining, with beautiful and perfect grain, edges of cracks are sharpned (see above all the right one), the nut on the top is not matching the surface and so on. I of course understand those had been restored, but is not possible to let ancient wood shining, even though found in perfect shape.
Do anybody knows if pommels are a modern replacement (as those in Nijemegen) or really are original?

[Medicus matt]

Original, as are all the hilt fittings. The anaerobic conditions of the Danish bogs have led to some incredible preservations of arms and equipment of the late Roman and early medieval periods. If you go to this thread, you'll find a link to an album of photographs I took last year at Illerup.

http://www.romanarmytalk.com/rat.html?fu...196#283482

[Thomas Aagaard]

http://www.moesmus.dk/da/udstillinger/mo...rup-aadal/
Its in danish. They are working on a english page.
Worth a look if you are in Denmark.

They are building a new museum that will open in June 2014.

I walk by daily since the museum is housed in the Moesgård Manor, just like "departments of Medieval and Renaissance Archaeology"(Århus university) where I study.

[Celer]

Salve

I think the pommel and guard are ivory on this one. The original colour of the ivory has been stained by the tanin in the bog.

Vale

Celer.

[marcos]

Thanks everybody. Medicus matt, can I ask you where your informations are from? I of course believe you but such wood is quite a miracle. We all saw several artifacts from anaerobic conditions, as Vindonissa, Vindolanda etc ( the enviroment of the latter is so exceptional that a centurion crest has survived) but wood is never in such perfect shape. Even in images you linked from the some findspot is possible to see some other wooden pieces, as those from a shield, but are in the shape you can exepct after 2000 years, although exceptional. Indeed is a miracle to have bright wood hock: ! Further, archaelogical wood is quite soft, impossible it still has sharpned edges of the cracks. Celer, I think those pommels are not from ivory because they oviously have wood's grains.
Is a problem of mine, but is very hard to me believe they are original.

[Caballo]

Marcos,

I can understand your reaction because of the astonishing state of preservation (which also preserved wood and textiles in some cases), but it is genuine.

Pictures here http://www.illerup.dk/deepweb.php?top=29&language=0

Tafel 174 and page 619 , Christian Miks , Studien zur romischen Schwerthewaffnung in der Kaiserzeit.

You might find this a useful introduction as well.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Illerup-Adal-Arc...757&sr=8-6

[Gunthamund Hasding]

marcos

I din't belived myself but if you look at pics during the diggings you will really realize that are practically as "new" as posible, they look from 2-3 years

http://www.illerup.dk/custom/illerup_lar...ension=jpg

http://www.illerup.dk/custom/illerup_lar...ension=jpg

cheers

[Medicus matt]

Medicus matt, can I ask you where your informations are from?

From:-
Illerup Adal: Die Schwerter: Textband / Katalog, Tafeln Und Fundlisten: v. 11 & 12 (Jutland Archaeological Society Publications)

and
Illerup Adal - Archaeology as a Magic Mirror.


That hilt and pommel is made from ivory. Ivory does have growth grain and centuries of tannin from the bog has emphasised it.

On the page after the picture of that sword in the 'Magick Mirror' book (page 80) is a photograph of a wooden hilted spatha before it was lifted from the mud of the bog and, again, the wood is smooth and shiny.

Different layers of the bog (dependant on date of deposition), even different areas, had different condtions, so the preservation of organic and ferrous materials varies widely across the site.

[Caballo]

One other find from the Danish bogs that I discovered reading the new book on the textiles (War and Worship: Textiles from 3rd 4th century AD weapons deposits , by Susan Moller- Wiering http://www.oxbowbooks.com/bookinfo.cfm/I...Result/Yes ) was tablet weave imprints being found on numerous spearheads.

The tablet weave that had been attached to the spear heads are long gone, but the marks are unmistakable.

This gives the first archaeological proof , I believe, to the streamers/ pennons shown in the Dura Europas graffitto of a clibanarius, and (more dodgily) the De Rebus Bellicis copied illustrations. For a long time, I have had tablet weave on my Late Roman spear as an identifier- and was very chuffed to see this new evidence. mile:

[Medicus matt]

My copy of that arrived this morning Paul, just looking through it now. Again, amazing preservaton.

[Gunthamund Hasding]

well if you look here:
http://www.illerup.dk/documents/illerup_73.pdf
on page 4 you will find on top exactly that what you want. The figure title is about: elfenben=ivory

[marcos]

well...nevertheless, unbeliavable indeed ! I guess the best preserved swords in the world, better than gladius from Rheinghonheim.

[M. Demetrius]

Those bogs contain a wealth of information waiting to be discovered.

[Cheyenne]

I have been using this book recently.. It is going to form the basis for a stitch by stitch reconstruction of the Thorsberg cloak for Ben Franckaert of the Letavians.

Lots of new and exciting info on the Danish finds....

[jvrjenivs]

I have been using this book recently.. It is going to form the basis for a stitch by stitch reconstruction of the Thorsberg cloak for Ben Franckaert of the Letavians.

Lots of new and exciting info on the Danish finds....

My copy is on its way, too