Leather Hand Guard/Glove to carry Scutum

[Antoninus05]

[attachment=819]P14_2011-05-05.jpg[/attachment]
Does anyone know where to buy a leather hand guard or glove to carry the scutum. A lot of Legion XIII guys had them this weekend, but I was busy and failed to ask anybody. On the picture from our recent encampment at Ft Parker, you can see one on the left hand of the Legion XIII member behind me, if anyone makes these, I'm in the market for one, Thanks, Antoninus

[Medicus matt]

Never seen anything like that before...is there any provenance for something like that?

Surely that indicates that there's something wrong with the way they make and/or carry their shields?

[Caballo]

New one on me too, and unaware of any provenance. I've got sheepskin lining the boss and edge on my first century scutum to prevent friction, and this could be an alternative to a "glove"?

[PhilusEstilius]

I know that having made many Roman shields and had a go at handling them there is the fact that they press against the back of the hand, I have not come across any evidence for this glove at all.
However what I have tried out myself is that if a piece of padding is put on the inside of the shield above the grip position say about an inch thick, one can take the pressure off the back of the hand and hold the shield in comfort.
It's cheating I know but I think so is that glove.

[M. CVRIVS ALEXANDER]

Having padding on the back of the scutum is not cheating - there is an image somewhere, I think TC, showing just that.

[Peroni]

Sheepskin! I have always used a pad of sheepskin inside all my shields and it works really well. (you can always chamfer the edge of the hand hole too to alleviate the digging-in to the back of the hand before gluing in the sheepskin.

[Antoninus05]

OK...sheepskin it is, makes sense, now, here in the US, does anyone know of a business that sells sheepskin readily?

Also, who is going to tell the XIII they are wrong, that guy behind me is pretty big!

Seriously, thanks for the tips guys, makes perfect sense, as that was the first time I really USED the scutum, it did "dig in" on the top of my hand and from the sound of it, a common problem with most folks. As always, glad I asked the group, and I appreciate all the responses. Antoninus

[Peroni]

old sheepskin rugs? Ebay is your friend!:wink:

[M. Demetrius]

I could sew you one, Mike, just say the word. And I have a piece of shearling sheepskin you may have for nothing. We bought a pair of those sheepy seat covers for a car from a second hand shop. They can be cut up into all sorts of stuff. We paid near nothing for the pair of them (since they're fitted to specific seats, I guess) and have used them for lots of gear.

The scraps make great leather stain or neatsfoot/linseed oil applicators. Just use them, and put them in a ziplock for later. They make pretty good insoles for shoes, warm and soft, even when wet...stick them inside your socks and off you go.

[soapbox] The bosses, and consequently the hand holes in shields are too small for modern giants. I submit, with no provenance, that they made the bosses of a size to fit the hands of the people they were made for. Since a typical Roman was about 5 of our feet tall, and the bosses were around 4" in diameter, and WE are typically around 6 ft tall, the bosses should be scaled up to fit our hands. Most of the trouble I've had with the small umbones is that they fit a 12 yr old fine, but my fist around the grip rubs the top of the hole.

I have compensated somewhat by putting all the extra wood strips of the grip on the back side of the crossing point of the double D hole, rounding (upside) off the entry to the hole, and even moving the hole up above center somewhat, all to try to prevent that pressure on the back of the hand. None of those things really work, and if the handle on a flat shield is moved much behind the plane of the shield, it's out of balance.

OTOH, making a larger boss, and a larger hole, the problem disappears. Call me stupid, but -- we make shoes to fit our feet, not to match the found specimens, make helmets to fit our heads, not the smallish ones that are found, so why not make the bosses to fit our hands instead of matching the historical record? [/soapbox]

[PhilusEstilius]

David
I have to agree with you on the sizes of Roman gear and in the past where I have made Roman bosses I have made them more in the region towards 5 inch diam'.

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

I pad and chamfer the edge of the hole like Peronis and all my problems with the scutum dissappeared instantly!
From suffering a dead hand for months after a days filming, to doing a 12 mile? march in Rome with no ill effects!
Although I am tempted to make some sort of glove for archery purposes.....

[M. CVRIVS ALEXANDER]

Ok, here it is - admittedly not very clear, but it could be sheepskin under the fist.

[attachment=831]doubleshieldharness_shipskin.jpg[/attachment]

[Doc]

How do you attach the sheepskin? I have some hand felted wool that I could use. I was thinking of just using a glue gun but once the felt gets worn it may not be that easy to remove it from the shield.

[M. Demetrius]

A couple of small brads should do the trick, Doc. Try it and see. If it works, great! If not, you might use glue, but hot glue is tough on the paint it contacts. Carpenter's glue might crack off more easily. However, I've found with felt that it's best to daub on the glue on the felt first, let it dry, then glue the felt to something. It wicks up all the glue at first, and may not hold to the surface of the shield. Using the two step process, you saturate the felt first, then glue the glue to the wood, so to speak.

Alex, isn't this a different sort of shield? Looks like a two loop grip. That's not the same thing, or the same carry problem. Or am I missing something?

[Doc]

Thanks for the tips.