Hellenistic warrior\'s grave found.

[Laran]

Hi all!

Actually this new is from about a year ago but I discovered it only now. I performed a search here but couldn't find anything on the topic. So, if this has been discussed already, forgive me :wink:
Anyway, it is about a warrior grave found by a farmer in a village around the city of Mugla, Turkey. The man was plowing his field when he discovered accurately placed stones and reported to the local directorate of museums. The archeologists discovered it was a grave. The grave was without inscription and contained a skeleton, a helmet, a sword and two pieces of pottery. The sword was corroded but the helmet was completely intact. The skull has a sword scar on it, which is believed to have caused the warrior's death. The grave is believed to date to the Hellenistic period and it was also suggested that the man might have been from Alexander the Great's army.
This is a quick translation and summry of a newspaper article. Here are the photos:

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

Thanks for that Laran.

Are there more pictures? Particularly of the helmet and skull? The scar seems relatively minor for a killing blow, possibly something that happened previously? It is hard to really see the scar well, reminds me of one I have on my own noggin!

[Laran]

The skull from different angle

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

Like I said, he could be a relation... :wink:

[Giannis K. Hoplite]

Thanks for the photos Laran,they're awesome. I would like to see a photo of the sword. I also wonder about the ethnicity of the soldier. Could it be a Skythian? Such helmets were common in there. Of course Alexander's soldier can not be ruled out,or any other Greek after Alexander for that matter. The scar on the scull is interesting,hwever it would be even more interesting if there was a hole on the helmet in that spot! Note how closely the helmet fits the scull. The only other greek helmet I know of that was found with the scull in was found in Marathon
Khaire
Giannis

[Laran]

@Gioi and Giannis,
I think it's hard to tell anything about his ethnicity at this point. Even though similar helmets were favoured by the Scythians, there is no other evidence to show he was a Scythian (horse harness, archery equipment, etc.)

@Byron,
Yes, the scar does not seem to be that deep. Especially, when you compare it to such wounds like the ones on the skulls from Wisby :roll: But, on the other hand, did the object that left the scar have to break/penetrate the skull to cause death? Couldn't he have died from cerebral hemorrhage, for example? Of course, I'm no expert in these, so can't say much.

In fact, certain mysterious details about this burial make me think the man may not have been killed in action, even though he was a warrior. The way he was burried is unusual, as noted by Gioi and if he really was killed by a blow on his head, then he wasn't wearing his helmet at the moment. Otherwise, as Giannis said, the helmet would have traces of such a blow that penetrated his helmet and reached his head. However, there doesn't seem to be such on the photos.

Could it be that he was killed while camping by his comrades in arms? :wink: He may have quarrelled with his companions for a certain reason (gambling, women, etc.) and one of them may have struck him on his head with some object (a weapon or some camping tool) and the man died either immediately or after a certain while. His comrades, since they didn't have enough time (or even if they did, they had to rest, consume energy for a march), burried him in a hurry by simply piling stones over his body. For some reason, they took part of his equipment (which he almost certainly had) but placed his helmet and sword beside him.

Well, it's only a scenario :wink: Other versions are welcome.

Nice work, Gioi, by the way.

[Giannis K. Hoplite]

Nice,anti-hollywoodistic scenario. Helmets are rarely burried with the men,especially being worn. However,the custom was alive in Macedonia,this may point to this ethnicity,together with the style of sword,which seems an odinary xiphos,from the little I can see.
Gioi,excellent sketch. Now show us the profile
Khairete
Giannis

[MeinPanzer]

Warrior burials from the late Classical and Hellenistic periods are very rare indeed, so this is a very important find. This is probably a late 4th c. BC burial, and considering the findspot, this very well could just be a Carian warrior. Was the article from a year ago or was it found a year ago?

[Laran]

Was the article from a year ago or was it found a year ago?

The article is.

[Kineas]

I'm an amateur, but that helmet looks 6th-5th C to me. Here's one in the Walters

I know--helmet dating is a dangerous game...

[MeinPanzer]

I'm an amateur, but that helmet looks 6th-5th C to me. Here's one in the Walters

I know--helmet dating is a dangerous game...

These helmets wereused all the way to the end of the fourth century BC. One is shown on the ground on the Alexander mosaic, for instance.

The article is.

And any idea of the find itself? It may have been published already or mentioned in an archaeological summary.

[Laran]

And any idea of the find itself? It may have been published already or mentioned in an archaeological summary.

No idea, unfortunately. I'll see if I can find something.

[Uwe Bahr]

Gaius Iulius Caesar wrote:

The scar seems relatively minor for a killing blow

Hi all,

if You look closer at the photos, You will see that he has two damages on his skull. The red arrow on the skull's right side is just visible. And both injuries seem to be echoed on the helmet - look closer, please. If You consider that a blow (perhaps with a dull sword) was heavy enough to deform the metall of the helmet and to deform the skull, then it seems likely to me that the two injuries caused the man's death.

Greets - Uwe

[Virilis]

This is VERY interesting! Here is evidence at last of how the helmet should fit the head of it`s wearer: VERY CLOSE :evil: ! Deepeeka, hear my words :wink: ...

[Laran]

Found a pic with overall view