Depeeka Greek helmet

[Tim Mathews]

Because I'm on a budget Ive been looking extenslively at the cheaper Greek helmets. Inparticular the Corinthian Hemlmet made by depeeka, in brass, with the large ear holes and small round nose guard.

I have assumed that possibly the following alterations could be made to it to make it more visually attractive and accurate.
Firstly, are the front chin pieces too long? They look it to me and could they be cut back?
Unfold all of the folded edges around the eyes and ears, maybe even chisel a defining line around the eye?
Depending on how much brass there is in the nose draw it out to make it less round and longer?
Not much can be done with the ear holes unless adding extra brass and brazing it in.

My thoughts, could anyone help before I decide to buy?

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

It is supposed to be a later version of the corinthian, so the earholes are correct, but the one I have handled a few years ago was really thin brass, and the nasal was way too flimsy. Not sure how well it would stand up to chiselling? :?

[Tim Mathews]

I have not seen any with ear holes, what date is this helmet based on?
Would people recomend getting this, re-shaping the nose to more of a point, and shortening the cheek guards so they don't look like sabre tooth tiger fangs!

[Tim Mathews]

What about these helmets http://www.ancientreplicas.com.au/5.html
scroll down to those with the longer nose guards and closed ears. They come with liners and chin straps that could easily be removed.

[ouragos]

The deepeeka 'italo' corinthian (their name for the one with the ear holes) comes in variable quality as it is made in a myriad of places. The better quality builds tend to have a nose piece that is folded back. Some of the truly awful ones are squared off across the eyes and have a V shape cut at the end of the nose.

This helment (the better one) is essentially OK - the back was smoothed off to facilitate construction so is wrong but in general terms (and it does vary from build to build) the eye sockets and cheek pieces are fine. It is circa 5th Cbc

Also note - there are brass plated versions around as well. Avoid these - it comes off with cleaning over time.

The nose piece is a littl over rounded, but not terrible in the main. Particularly if you get a folded nose version.

The Corinthian you refer to on the site is not deepeeka but another manufacture. I have seen brass and plated versions of these too. Generally on the heavy side (thick gauge metal) the general shape is pretty good and the back is fine. One or two look a little 'elongated', but remember, these are all handmade. The ones I have seen are for fairly large heads.

Check diameter when you buy.

You can see pics of both across www.hoplites.org - look in the diary page and scan the event pictures. I would check the last 3 events of 2007, if I recall you should see both of the above there.

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

I have not seen any with ear holes, what date is this helmet based on?
Would people recomend getting this, re-shaping the nose to more of a point, and shortening the cheek guards so they don't look like sabre tooth tiger fangs!

Sorry what do you mean by ear-holes? I was thinking of the cutouts, which is a correct helmet, of later type. Do you mean ones with a round hole in the ear area? I don't have my books here so cannot say if there are any of that type. Fortunately genetics allow me to dispense wit hthe need for cutouts in a corinthian... :lol:

[Tim Mathews]

Sorry, the ear holes I was meaning the open area where the front meets the back.
Was there any ever evidence of the helmets being painted?

[ouragos]

any ever evidence of the helmets being painted

Masses - see the other threads. You will see one on the site I sent you to but there are lots of examples posted in the neswgroup.

[Giannis K. Hoplite]

Hello Tim. OK,the deepeeka one is not that accurate in look,but some corinthian helms with ear holes have been found. They are not many,but they existed.Some believe it was an intermediate stage between the corinthian and the chalkidean. Here there is a modified deepeeka into a chalkidean that looks nice. http://www.hetairoi.de/Offers.php For some reason I cannot open the photo,perhaps Kallimachos can post it here.
I'm afraid you cannot get did of that ridge around the helmet. You would have to straighten it by hammering,I think.
As said,painting is ok. The other corinthian without ear holes looks better. But as Andy said,usually it seems too big.
The "early Spartan" can also look better with modification. Especially if you make the eye holes bigger and if you paint it partially.
Khaire
Giannis

[Matthew Amt]

Here there is a modified deepeeka into a chalkidean that looks nice.

http://www.hetairoi.de/Images/Offers/Heuneburg6.JPG

Presumably the one at the right end of the line? Very clever, I like it!

I still think that the Deepeeka "Italo-Corinthian" (it isn't "Italo" at all, of course...) is still about the best mass-produced Corinthian available. Yes, the cheekpieces are kind of long, but it shouldn't be too hard to trim them. Then either make a new edge to more or less match the rest, or hammer out or trim off the edge elsewhere. The ear cut-outs are correct for a late Corinthian (Persian War era), but if you don't like them and can get someone to braze a patch over them, go for it! A little filing on the nasal and it will be pointier.

There are other companies trying to copy that helmet, always adding their own mistakes (while faithfully copying Deepeeka's mistakes!). Beware of the ones that have the ridge around the eyes running straight across the top of the nasal! Remember that the nasal is a NASAL, and it doesn't need to extend down any farther than the end of your nose. In this case it probably looks short because the cheekpieces are so long.

Hadn't seen those ones on the Ancient Replicas page before. They look a lot like the Corinthians that Albion used to sell, made in India by International Steelcrafts. On those ones, the edging was added-on, like on a Roman helmet. (Correct for Romans, wrong for Greeks!) Still looks like the cheekpieces are all too long. Nice crests! They all say "Out of Stock", though...

SOME day some Indian company will nail down the details, and offer a better Corinthian in bronze or at least red brass instead of yellow brass. Would be nice to see a nice cheap pilos helmet, too--you'd think that would be easy... Love to see a REAL *early* Corinthian, too, one of the really plain "bullet head" ones.

Khaire!

Matthew

[Giannis K. Hoplite]

Thanks for posting it Matt. Yes i was talking about the one at the right. All of these helmets are modified deepeeka ones (except for the obvious one that is not deepeeka).
The edges,Matt,there were some greek helmets with added-on edge. I took this photo in the Agrigento museum and there were one or two more similar chalcidean helmets with the same efect in the edge.
http://hoplitikon.com/Greek%20Armour/AN ... %20188.jpg
But it is more elegant than any reproduction...
Khairete
Giannis

[Kallimachos]

Thanks for the post Matt, I am sometimes to slow :-) )
In our opinion, the deepeeka helmets are okay but need some custom made to look real good.

[Tim Mathews]

I like the paint jobs.
I have read that the helmets, along with most of a hoplites panoply, was handed down through the family. The helmets were quite thin. Would it be possible that the helmets (if one that was passed down through a few fathers) could look old, worn, and a paint job starting to wear away?
I like the idea of a worn helmet, with paint wearing away.

How much into the future do people concieve an Indian Company may start producing helmets in red brass or bronze? I saw one on Albion Armouries site made in bronze and for a price the same as the one in question, but it was only to fit a head 21 inches diameter.

[Giannis K. Hoplite]

Hmm,worn helmets...Well,no one can tell for sure,but usually these warriors were trying to look good and colourful and shiny and impressive. Of cource every individual would act differently,but the general concept is that of a clean shiny armour. And a used helmet did not necessarily have marks of weapons on it,as most of the men didn't ever receive blows. But it's a personal choice,either accurate or inaccurate. The best way would be to paint it with natural paints and leave it ware out after long use.
Khaire
Giannis

[ouragos]

SOME day some Indian company will nail down the details, and offer a better Corinthian

It is happening now - I have prototypes of all of the following in production with one Indian manufacturer. If they manage to get them right they should be available, commercially, to traders by the end of the year.

(You will se them if the attachements worked...still trying to get images to load!)