Brass work for Gladius in process.

[Titus Marius Secundus]

here's of the handle. You can hardly tell by eye how the handle was made, With a cam, kinda gives away a bit. I'm sure there were wood handles all one piece, or like it :oops: anyway :-P

[Titus Marius Secundus]

Does anyone have any tips for centering a rivet?

[Titus Marius Secundus]

Hello again everyone, here's yet another update, kinda a break through, but damn the rivets were hard to make and fit! Brass is really ignorant, but looks great. There are minor defects, but hardly, and I think for my first, hopefully good work. Here we are!!!...yes that's my work table and yes it's wrapped in clean film....hehe, stop the tarnishing and touching of the sweaty hands making it go brown. Then I hopefully don't have to polish it again for a year, or till it's all finished :-?

ENJOY! comments welcome..
Sam

[Titus Marius Secundus]

What can you emboss on a half inch 30 thou strip of brass? a simple ridge? this is for cross hangers, to support the weight of the sword. Also, does anyone have any pictures of findings of pommels? For a Fulham, but a Mainz or a Pompeii should do.The pommel has to be a bit big, wide in diameter so it can cover half an inch of metal tang. It's a beginners mistake... It can have a wide base, and be average at the knob, I'm thinking!

Thanks in Advance!

Sam

[Titus Marius Secundus]

Ok so tonight didn't go so well :-( First off I have a very sore thumb as I hit it with a plastic mallet while attempting to fix up a brass piece which is for the back of the scabbard up top Should be ok to carry things with tomorrow, so I guess I didn't get outa chores this time :neutral:

I did polish all of the locket plate, and there's a couple specks I gotta do on the final polish when assembling. I small dented this rectangular brass plate to the point of no return, even after annealing... so I am going to ask for a double checking... here are some pics and a couple or 3 questions.

Pic #1 is the front plate wrapped up.

Pic #2 is the back, so you can see what the back pieces are going to be riveted to, soldering if I have to!

On pic #3 I have the half inch piece I plan on going around the edge of the very top of the pocket plate. I think this should go all the way around, and I feel good about making some stamps for a pretty design, so I'm sure that will be good idea. Opinion?]

AND pic #4 The large piece of brass is the right shape of what I'm thinking of going at the back top of the locket plate, but I messed that one up... Double checking, I saw one Matt Lukes made with the same thing, is it ok for my locket plate too? it was a Pompeii. /...and the Brass strip going around to the back is shown.

Sam

[Titus Marius Secundus]

P.S sorry about the gruesome pic of my ugly sore thumb :?

[Titus Marius Secundus]

I have been trying to make the cross hangers with the design I'm copying off the Porto Novo locket plate, with two concave grooves and in between a convex groove with a concave ridge. I have successfully made a male and female punch, but the vice doesn't come together well, ( my big vice) on some scrap metal I'll try it on my smaller vice but hopefully more accuracy on the punch, so one groove won't be deeper the the other. Also, I'm having trouble, which has been mentioned in Crispvs' blog post that, it's difficult to make the grooves run straight. This is mostly because the metal is so long, and gets in the way of the table. I'll have to turn the punch around so the metal strip is horizontal. So if anyone has any advice on stamping metal strips, I could do with some help.

Sam

[kazeryu]

If I understand your setup correctly, here is an idea...

take a 2x4 (or whatever is lying around) and cut a channel into it at exactly the same width as your strip of metal, and at least as long as your stamp width.

Then mount the female stamp inside this channel and check that it will stamp a level line when you drop your brass strip into the channel. Get everything locked down with screws or epoxy and check it again for levelness.

Now you just press, slide the metal 1/2 the width of the stamp, press, slide the metal 1/2 the width of the stamp, press, ....etc.

The channel in the wood stops the metal from twisting around too much, and using the 1/2 overlap helps each stamping to line up with the last one.

If I was doing similar work, I would make the female stamp directly in the wooden channel - depending on how much time you spent making yours it might be easier to just re-do it rather than mounting it into the wooden channel.

Edit: obviously this assumes that your male stamp is the exact same size as the female one so that it will fit into the channel...

[Titus Marius Secundus]

Right so here are some pictures of what exactly I've been doing. I got the idea off Crispvs' blog, worked on the smaller piece of brass ALMOST perfectly. Might be the vice not coming together, that ONE ridge doesn't get stamped at all. So here they are...


And now, your method, make a groove for the stamp in wood( both pieces so they are always straight? so the top won't be lose above straight groove? ) And have the brass strip fit in this groove in between the stamps, and HAMMER? down on the stamp? Orrrrr Make the wood as one half of the stamp ( is that solid enough?) and just have the male punch the brass into the finely detailed grooved wood?

Much appreciation, Sam. Oh and I finally got that lathe I've been looking at for a while, good reviews, not an everyday all day thing, so great enough, and it was for a bargain price If you have any suggestions to make, I'm open. Don't be too hopeful thought :-?

[Titus Marius Secundus]

also, bending the original design I'm following is very hard, if not impossoble without creasing the metal! So making the loops? OMGOODNES!!! Um, if anyone can, could you draw me a diagram on paint or something showing me a design diagram for the grooves? All I can find except the original design are bird eye views of the scabbards, also, so many different scabbards are out there, I'm confused what's safe to use!

Sam

[Crispvs]

Your progress is looking very good Sam!

On the matter of bending the cross hanger, as I said in an earlier post, measure the length first and only emboss between the places to be bent. This means that the viewer sees an embossed cross hanger but the actual bend is at a point which is actually not embossed. On actual examples we can often see one embossed pattern running along the front, with a slight gap at each end of this (where the piece is to be bent) after which a different embossed pattern takes over at either side to strengthen the projecting loops which contain the suspension rings. If you look you will see that this method was also used for the Porto Novo cross hangers.

Although this will solve your initial problem of bending the metal to start to form the loops, you are then left with another issue - that is, how to bend the embossed loops around without destroying the embossed finish. The answer here is to anneal the areas to be bent into the loops first with a torch, bringing the brass to an orange-red colour before letting it cool down. It should bend quite easily then and with far less chance of breaking or losing the embossed pattern.

Regarding the half inch band of brass you were thinking or putting around the top of the locket, I am not sure what the evidence for this is. There were some probable scabbard parts found at Hod Hill, one of which certainly did seem to be a band to go around the mouth of a scabbard and which was decorated with a series of small stamped oval shapes. I have seen this reproduced on reconstructed scabbards and this may be what Matt Lukes has based this in. I would check with him though if I were you. He is generally very helpful and he really does know what he is talking bout when it comes to this sort of thing.

Crispvs

[Titus Marius Secundus]

Thank you Crispvs, I am no longer going with the half inch cross brace/bar, as #1 It wouldn't look any better unless patterned, #2 more work, #3 not sufficient evidence when also using the style locket plate I am using.
I can see that with the Porto Novo cross hangers, they seem at an angle groove at the front, but not around the loops, which a new pattern starts after the rivets, ( more complex)and where the rivets are, there is no embossing looks like? For the loops, as I have a side view, this was the pattern I was going with, 2 concave side groves, with one in between, that one being convex with a middle small ridge, which you can see in my example picture. I cant make the outer two grooves proud at the sides, and I will be folding over the edge by an eighth of an inch, because that's the most suited brass they had, and adding strength, and a blunt edge. I might make another stamp up take me a day or two, it's hard getting them to match up!

I think I'm following you pretty well with the first part of your reply, the main bend of the loops occur where the rivets begin, out to where they start going back the way. Anyway, I will probably not have to make a stamp for the simple single angle ridge, but try and file down better the one I have. Do you have any idea how I could bring Ventus's method to life?

Regards, Sam

[Titus Marius Secundus]

I am considering to make a plate that covers the entry of the blade into the scabbard, but I know it's not important, nor necessary, so it's a though. Stab a brass plate, gently hammer it down the blade, and then fold over around the guard? haha, annealed maybe of course, but it's a quick idea, now too considering... :oops: :roll:

[kazeryu]

Here is a pictorial illustration of my suggestion.

[Titus Marius Secundus]

Ahhhh right, gotcha now, my apologies :-| So as this certain style requires a little ridge, the wood wouldn't be hard enough, Crispvs, maybe you can show me an easier design. I probably won't be working on it till the weekend, so I have time to ponder. Yes both male and female are the same size, and as in the picture, with the rasp, that's me leveling them down into a rectangle. It took me ages to make them fit well, which apparently the female is being stubborn by not coming together with the male evenly, thus one side of the brass strip showing a sharper strike than the other, if I emboss twice, I break the brass, Crispvs suggested annealing. I will do this I could accomplish a straight strike with the shorter piece as where the other's length got in the way and was terrible. Also, I guess across the scabbard it's just a simple angular groove, and then flat for the bend and rivets, and then a fancier embossing where the suspension rings go. Now, would brass wire or what do you suggest for those rings? I saw what you did Crispvs, how has that worked for you? Are the rivets those short ones that I made for the chape, or do these ones go through the scabbard? I'm thinking about the weight here...
Anyway, thanks a lot, I'll post my progress, I need to get Ace Hardware to get some more brass strips!!1 they only have one more left

Sam