02-13-2014, 02:43 AM
Hi guys
A really fascinating discussion, from my perspective. It did raise more than a few questions and observations, a couple of which I will pitch in here as it seems a good point to do so...
If there were 60 centurions per legion, plus and at any one time there were a good percentage dead or injured, plus another percentage potentially travelling back and forth (if that theory is correct), at any one time the active number of actual centurions could have been very low, especially by the end of campaign season during a time of conquest.
I assume the same would hold true for promotion etc of centurions with auxiliary cohorts and marines. Later on the same would be true for Praetorians and urban cohorts?
I can understand perhaps legions stationed near to Rome, travelling to a central ceremony, but from Britannia (for example) that would seem very restrictive.
It also raises another question. Many legions and Auxillia were raised far from Rome, for example IX Hispana. Centurions would no doubt ship out from Rome to start recruiting, along with kit etc. however I assume some could transfer from other legions in the area.... Otherwise the lead time to create a legion could be a big problem, even for Caesar and the legions he raised in transalpine Gaul before his conquest of Gaul (XI and XII if I remember correctly... I think he also raised IX and X just before?) if I also remember correctly he started raising those legions before he had senate approval? I assume before Augustus that the Imperateur would deal with field promotions and the appointment of his own officers?
After Augustus, were all officers, not just centurions, appointed by the emperor or at least the central command (under the paradigm where centurions were)
I also imagine that what happened during a settled period, in a settled area (such as Southern Gaul in 1st century) versus what happened in Britannia 50ad - 100ad would be very different. For example, looking at the allied forces in 2nd world war, appointments and promotions may well be ratified by central command, but they were put in place by commanders on the ground with no grand ceremony... Whereas during peacetime time was a luxury they can indulge in and while a promotion relies upon recommendation, it often has exams and ceremonies associated with it.
To me that would seem more realistic. Ie an ideal model, for peacetime, and a workable model when not. That of course could be just my modern lack of sensitivity to the Roman way, but then the Romans were quite pragmatic.
A really fascinating discussion, from my perspective. It did raise more than a few questions and observations, a couple of which I will pitch in here as it seems a good point to do so...
If there were 60 centurions per legion, plus and at any one time there were a good percentage dead or injured, plus another percentage potentially travelling back and forth (if that theory is correct), at any one time the active number of actual centurions could have been very low, especially by the end of campaign season during a time of conquest.
I assume the same would hold true for promotion etc of centurions with auxiliary cohorts and marines. Later on the same would be true for Praetorians and urban cohorts?
I can understand perhaps legions stationed near to Rome, travelling to a central ceremony, but from Britannia (for example) that would seem very restrictive.
It also raises another question. Many legions and Auxillia were raised far from Rome, for example IX Hispana. Centurions would no doubt ship out from Rome to start recruiting, along with kit etc. however I assume some could transfer from other legions in the area.... Otherwise the lead time to create a legion could be a big problem, even for Caesar and the legions he raised in transalpine Gaul before his conquest of Gaul (XI and XII if I remember correctly... I think he also raised IX and X just before?) if I also remember correctly he started raising those legions before he had senate approval? I assume before Augustus that the Imperateur would deal with field promotions and the appointment of his own officers?
After Augustus, were all officers, not just centurions, appointed by the emperor or at least the central command (under the paradigm where centurions were)
I also imagine that what happened during a settled period, in a settled area (such as Southern Gaul in 1st century) versus what happened in Britannia 50ad - 100ad would be very different. For example, looking at the allied forces in 2nd world war, appointments and promotions may well be ratified by central command, but they were put in place by commanders on the ground with no grand ceremony... Whereas during peacetime time was a luxury they can indulge in and while a promotion relies upon recommendation, it often has exams and ceremonies associated with it.
To me that would seem more realistic. Ie an ideal model, for peacetime, and a workable model when not. That of course could be just my modern lack of sensitivity to the Roman way, but then the Romans were quite pragmatic.
