03-21-2004, 05:57 PM
OK, I finally managed to read the article (it took a bit of time because Der Spiegel wants money for it which I won't pay), and it is not <em>quite</em> what you wrote, Dan..<br>
<br>
Summarising, Spiegel names a lot of names but no references, so I can't check any of their claims. However, what they say is roughly this: after the defeat of Varus, Rome took a year to regroup and them launched years of revenge-attacks, bloody slaughter and scorched earth, countered by a guerilla-war lead by Arminius ('Che Guevara/Vietnam' is used), who led an enemy who would not be drawn into a battle. They mention other battles, very costly defeats for the Romans, and have Orosius say that the rel battle took place later.<br>
<br>
But Orosius, of course, wrote much much later (during the early 5th century). More serious indeed is the criticism from the Tübinger numismatcian Reinhard Wolters, who has re-evalued the coin finds, and proposes that issues dating between 9 and 16 AD do not come from Varus, but from a later battle.<br>
<br>
For even the critics do not doubt that Kalkriese was a battlefield, and that an ambush took place from behind a wall, and that large numbers of Romans died there in a big defeat.<br>
Sorry dan, no "overwhelming evidence that is was a Roman military outpost" is mentioned, and no one thinks it "absurd from the beginning to believe this small site with an isolated pocket of artifacts could be conected with an Army numbering tens of thousands of men, in a column which stretched for miles" either.<br>
The critics only think that Varus was defeated elsewhere, but that Kalkriese was possibly the spot where Germanicus evaded a defeat, but at the cost of his supply column and thousands of lives.<br>
<br>
If you want, I can print the German text here.<br>
<br>
Valete,<br>
Valerius/Robert <p></p><i></i>
<br>
Summarising, Spiegel names a lot of names but no references, so I can't check any of their claims. However, what they say is roughly this: after the defeat of Varus, Rome took a year to regroup and them launched years of revenge-attacks, bloody slaughter and scorched earth, countered by a guerilla-war lead by Arminius ('Che Guevara/Vietnam' is used), who led an enemy who would not be drawn into a battle. They mention other battles, very costly defeats for the Romans, and have Orosius say that the rel battle took place later.<br>
<br>
But Orosius, of course, wrote much much later (during the early 5th century). More serious indeed is the criticism from the Tübinger numismatcian Reinhard Wolters, who has re-evalued the coin finds, and proposes that issues dating between 9 and 16 AD do not come from Varus, but from a later battle.<br>
<br>
For even the critics do not doubt that Kalkriese was a battlefield, and that an ambush took place from behind a wall, and that large numbers of Romans died there in a big defeat.<br>
Sorry dan, no "overwhelming evidence that is was a Roman military outpost" is mentioned, and no one thinks it "absurd from the beginning to believe this small site with an isolated pocket of artifacts could be conected with an Army numbering tens of thousands of men, in a column which stretched for miles" either.<br>
The critics only think that Varus was defeated elsewhere, but that Kalkriese was possibly the spot where Germanicus evaded a defeat, but at the cost of his supply column and thousands of lives.<br>
<br>
If you want, I can print the German text here.<br>
<br>
Valete,<br>
Valerius/Robert <p></p><i></i>
Robert Vermaat
MODERATOR
FECTIO Late Romans
THE CAUSE OF WAR MUST BE JUST
(Maurikios-Strategikon, book VIII.2: Maxim 12)
MODERATOR
FECTIO Late Romans
THE CAUSE OF WAR MUST BE JUST
(Maurikios-Strategikon, book VIII.2: Maxim 12)
