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+--- Thread: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet (/showthread.php?tid=11204)
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Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - Dave G - 12-07-2007
http://www.romanarmy.com/cms/component/ ... Itemid,96/
I was looking through the helmet database and have noticed an unusual detail about this helmet, on the inside where the neckguard begins there is a bronze flange attached underneath the neckguard and continuing the line of the helmet down slightly in line with the wearers head. On this vertical part there are three slots.
Has there been any speculation or research that would suggest a purpose for this attachment?
I thought it may be to attach strapping at first,but the fact these holes are rectangular slots rather than rivet holes make me wonder otherwise.
Would something else be attached? What?
http://www.romanarmy.com/cms/index2.php ... talH-2.jpg
Re: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - Tarbicus - 12-07-2007
A leather strap would pass through them nicely.
Re: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - Gaius Julius Caesar - 12-07-2007
I figure they may have had a pad attached to stop the helmet tipping back all the time?
Re: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - Caratacus - 12-07-2007
Damn! Never noticed that before! :oops:
Yes, I agree with Jim - this might well be an alternative method for securing the helmet to the wearer's head, instead of the ring at the rear of the neck guard. It might even be a more reliable method of doing so - in which case we have another puzzle - why wasn't it used more often?
Re: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - Gaius Julius Caesar - 12-07-2007
Or you could possibly have a doubler attached, or secure it to your armour.... I think a pad would be a good possibility tho', given there are three holes?
Re: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - Tarbicus - 12-07-2007
Quote:Damn! Never noticed that before! :oops:Yup, I also wish I'd spotted that when I was making the plans for the Deepeeka version. :?
Yes, I agree with Jim - this might well be an alternative method for securing the helmet to the wearer's head, instead of the ring at the rear of the neck guard. It might even be a more reliable method of doing so - in which case we have another puzzle - why wasn't it used more often?
Perhaps it just wasn't that popular? That said, and AFAIK, we always assume very thin leather thonging was used on other helmets and simply tied. For all we know it may have been straps, still thin, but with buckles, or studs that went through holes. It's something I've mulled over now and again. AFAIK, the Pyrrhus bust with the straps that fix onto the cheek piece outer studs via holes (Montefortinos and Galic A style) is the only decent representation we have of such a thing. If anyone else knows of any others they'd be good to see.
Re: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - Gaius Julius Caesar - 12-07-2007
I was wondering why you didn't put it in.... :roll:
In fact I was sure I had asked if it was being included.....
Re: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - Tarbicus - 12-07-2007
Quote:I was wondering why you didn't put it in.... :roll:Really? I just looked through the entire thread and can't find any mention of it.
In fact I was sure I had asked if it was being included.....
(edited)
Re: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - Dave G - 12-07-2007
I have to doubt the strapping answer,the reason being if a strap were to be passed through this piece I think at least four slots would be needed to make it symmetrical and secure otherwise it would pull to one side.
I ask myself, what would need slots?
I have the Depeeka repro of this helmet and may attempt to make this piece myself at some stage,perhaps it'll make sense when its worn.
Re: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - Gaius Julius Caesar - 12-07-2007
You probably scared me out of asking.... :wink:
Re: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - Tarbicus - 12-07-2007
It could be two fixed straps either side. The right strap crosses over to the left side of the neck, and vice versa for the other. The straps then secure the helmet to the head better. The central slot could be for each strap to loop through and back to themselves, where they could be securely stitched. There'd be little point in four slots with that arrangement, as a fourth slot would just be 'make work'.
Re: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - Gaius Julius Caesar - 12-07-2007
But then they would be tight on a sherp edge?
Re: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - Tarbicus - 12-07-2007
But if the helmet's secure then there might not be much rubbing.
Who knows?
Re: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - Gaius Julius Caesar - 12-07-2007
Possibly! I would still want some padding mind you....my helmet tips back, so i had a cap made wit han extended pad to balance it. But it may just be the modern helms!
But that is not a bad idea the more I think on it...
Re: Question about the Gutmann italic H iron helmet - LUCIUS ALFENUS AVITIANUS - 12-07-2007
The Guttman helmet have a bigger neckguard than other helmets. probably to support the extra weight of the neckguard, is the reason because that implement is used... Who knows? :lol: