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Helmet Database
#1
Quote:Or perhaps a republishing of all articles and papers on helmets under one volume. It gets really frustrating at times. :roll:

And most importantly, it should be available as a purchasable and downloadable PDF file. It drives me absolutely potty. :evil: The same with swords and shields.

Ave Tarbicus,

Great idea! What’s about a ‘self-developing’ source guide, similar to this deepeeka forum?

No ‘consumer guide’, but a collection of resources to Roman equipment. A single topic for each item (sub classified in armor, weapons, tools and ‘miscellaneous / unknown classification’). So everyone could add photographs, drawings (if not colliding with copyright), links, books or articles to that item (full tile, author, publisher, year, ISBN and page number), museum or private collection, where it is exhibited, own descriptions/comments of the item, pointing out the essential features.

The combined ‘virtual knowledge’ and collection of books, articles, photos or even originals of all RAT members should be gigantic. Unfortunately, each one only disposing his own piece of the cake, and has to start his own ‘research from scratch’, when information to a special item is needed. Such a database could save a lot of search-engine time (and sometimes help to find the right page or photograph in your own vast collection at home..)

Frequently, someone might copy all together as a download able pdf-file.
Greetings from germania incognita

Heiko (Cornelius Quintus)

Quantum materiae materietur marmota monax si marmota monax materiam possit materiari?
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#2
Jasper, Heiko has a good idea there. Thing is, how to keep it organised, and how to organise it in the first place?

Is this worthy of a subforum, with subfora below it, a bit like Marketplace? Maybe something like:

EQUIPMENT REFERENCES:
>Swords
>Shields
>Body Armour
>etc....


Or is it more suited to RA.com's existing lot? Heiko's idea means that anything anyone finds can be posted here on RAT, and that can then be copied when and where appropriate into the RA.com database perhaps.
TARBICvS/Jim Bowers
A A A DESEDO DESEDO!
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#3
As I told Spedius before, I'm of the opinion that although this forum is database-driven (...), it is not the best model for such a project. As I keep saying, the main site IS built for cooperative work.

[size=75:1ycf95az](Yes, I know there's a problem with the editor now, but I expect that to be fixed any time now.)[/size]

The best option, I'd say, is to have the database on the main site, find a team who will get the capability to update the thing and a subforum where everyone else can add their suggestions & updates. How's that?
Greets!

Jasper Oorthuys
Webmaster & Editor, Ancient Warfare magazine
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#4
Quote:The best option, I'd say, is to have the database on the main site, find a team who will get the capability to update the thing and a subforum where everyone else can add their suggestions & updates. How's that?

Ave Jasper,

that's really the best way. The question is, how to get started.

I am a fan of wikipedia as an open source project, but controlled ans supervised by the editors. That's ok when you already have a broad basis of data.

On the other hand, the Deepeeka forum demonstrates, how much information can be thrown in 'by the way' and by lots of different RAT members.

Personally, as a journalist, I am used to investigate ad research. And I always look for expert's information from one hand - very hard to find.

That's why I like the Deepeeka forum. I'll find nearly anything about the a special helmet type in it's special topic. At least more data, than searching with different engines, keywords or following endless links. Editorial supervising would be perfect and perhaps one day I'll could find any worthy resource about it (in full text/picture or as a link/credit) without surfing through the web in an odyssey.

So featuring an equipment resource guide at the main page 'romanarmy.com' would without doubt be the more serious way. On the other hand you'll need a 'living' forum discussion to offer an easy way of adding new information.

For example: if I personally would find some good reconstruction photos of the Hebron helmet in a new book, I won't hesitate to add a remark in a special forum topic. But if I would have to search the FAQ first to find a message form that I'll have to send to the special arranger of the source guide...

Even journalists are far from being all knowing (they only are pretending that). Without data delivered by others they remain overworked experts, more struggling in research than in writing, commenting and publishing their results :wink: .

It's a pity: So many times my research was of no avail, only to hear later in a smalltalk by chance: 'Oh, that. I made lots of photos of it while on holiday some years ago' or 'My grandfather had one - it must lie anywhere around here' or 'Why didn't you ask me - there are 10 books and Magazines about it in my collection' or 'Interesting, that's exactly the topic of my dissertation' :wink:

800 RAT members will mean about at least 800 collections, 800 private libraries, 800 experienced experts/hobbyists, 800 cameras, 1600 eyes... :wink: (Please excuse a newbie still impressed by the power of RAT Big Grin )

Perhaps you could inset RAT to collect as much information as possible and have an editorial staff team redacting it to an 'official' equipment guide.
Greetings from germania incognita

Heiko (Cornelius Quintus)

Quantum materiae materietur marmota monax si marmota monax materiam possit materiari?
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#5
Quote:Perhaps you could inset RAT to collect as much information as possible and have an editorial staff team redacting it to an 'official' equipment guide.

Isn't that what I said? Is what I meant anyways. A team of volunteer RAT-ers would edit the database with info collected in a special forum.
Here's a model for the helmet database: http://www.romanarmy.com/cms/index.php? ... &Itemid=96

I already have a load of info for the database courtesy of Mike Thomas/ Caratacus. Need more original pictures though.
Also, please note that there's an UNLIMITED number of graphics files that can be connected to each record. Basically then, every record could have photos of the inside and outside, of reconstructions and could have detail drawings too.
Greets!

Jasper Oorthuys
Webmaster & Editor, Ancient Warfare magazine
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#6
Quote:
Quote:Perhaps you could inset RAT to collect as much information as possible and have an editorial staff team redacting it to an 'official' equipment guide.

Here's a model for the helmet database: http://www.romanarmy.com/cms/index.php? ... &Itemid=96

I already have a load of info for the database courtesy of Mike Thomas/ Caratacus. Need more original pictures though.
Also, please note that there's an UNLIMITED number of graphics files that can be connected to each record. Basically then, every record could have photos of the inside and outside, of reconstructions and could have detail drawings too.

Ave Jasper,

that's perfect! The sample is already convincing. With some added larger photos, drawings Big Grin

What do you expect that recruits for editing the database and collecting data in a special forum have to know and to do to satisfy the requirements of the task?
Greetings from germania incognita

Heiko (Cornelius Quintus)

Quantum materiae materietur marmota monax si marmota monax materiam possit materiari?
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#7
Quote:What do you expect that recruits for editing the database and collecting data in a special forum have to know and to do to satisfy the requirements of the task?

Computerskills: very limited
Collecting skills: high
Zeal: enormous
Greets!

Jasper Oorthuys
Webmaster & Editor, Ancient Warfare magazine
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#8
*poof*

new forum...
Greets!

Jasper Oorthuys
Webmaster & Editor, Ancient Warfare magazine
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#9
Antike Helm is on its way to my graduate carrell in the Paley Library as we speak. I am very busy but happy to put down the morphologies as a kind of back bone.

We can do this the way my Architectural history prof built his database. He took the most comprehensive and widely accepted textbooks on american architecture, used them to build a list for all the captions and then got all his friends in the society of architectural historians to donate their pictures

It became a virtual textbook, minus the copyright issues. Basically, if an object made a majority of books, it made the list and then he begged for images. Later he got everyone involved to write essays for their objects. Worked really well. It's still there and available to everyone.
Theodoros of Smyrna (Byzantine name)
aka Travis Lee Clark (21st C. American name)

Moderator, RAT

Rules for RAT:
<a class="postlink" href="http://www.romanarmy.com/rat/viewtopic.php?Rules">http://www.romanarmy.com/rat/viewtopic.php?Rules for posting

Oh! and the Toledo helmet .... oh hell, forget it. :? <img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_confused.gif" alt=":?" title="Confused" />:?
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#10
That's the idea Big Grin
I just sent 130 photos to Tarbicus for cleaning up. I'm sure there are more members with photos.
Greets!

Jasper Oorthuys
Webmaster & Editor, Ancient Warfare magazine
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#11
Quote:I'm sure there are more members with photos.
What sort of picture can you use? Scanned from books or just the ones without copyright?
_________________________________
Robert Vermaat
MODERATOR: Forum rules
FECTIO Late Roman Society
THE CAUSE OF WAR MUST BE JUST
(Maurikios-Strategikon, book VIII.2: Maxim 12)
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#12
I'd say: use the same principle as we do for the imagebase. That is, books older than 75 years (i.e. no copyright), but preferably photos you made yourself.
Greets!

Jasper Oorthuys
Webmaster & Editor, Ancient Warfare magazine
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#13
Ummm...

A while back I offered use of my GIS software licences for RAT. It does have the capability to link images and scanned papers to to a spatial entity, as well as normal database tables. There is the potential for creating a seperate map theme for helmets, beltpates, or any classification of artifacts. Each theme would contain a table of descriptive attributes. Other themes, which can be turned off an on by the viewer, would include forts and any descriptive attributes, like unit affiliation, roads and whatnot. Hydrology, Topography, aireal photos, etc. Scale and resolution are issues, but can be nested, i.e. a map theme of the Danube shows forts. As you zoom in the floor plan of the fort turns on. This depends on availabe data of course.

The main software holds and edits data, (Arc/Info PC, ArcView 9). There is a free download viewer called Arc Explorer that viewers coud use for analysis purposes and for creating maps, etc.

ESRI licences the Arc/zinfo and ArcView stuff and has offices world wide. Check out the GIS capabilities at the local site for your country or region by running a Google search.

Ralph Izard
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#14
Hi Ralph,
I have to admit that I forgot you had this available. But looking into it now, I'm a little daunted at the idea of having to get it installed on a webserver I have no direct control over, not to mention figuring out how to integrate it into the current website. The trouble would not be client-side, I think, but server-side.
Also, for what we are envisioning, the current database system seems well suited. If/when we want to place those artifacts in their spatial environment, we'd have to come back to GIS or a mod on googlemaps.
Still, your generous offer is much appreciated!
Greets!

Jasper Oorthuys
Webmaster & Editor, Ancient Warfare magazine
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#15
Thanks to your great photos of the Neidermoermter helmet Jasper, I can now see the standards (Signa) pictured on the ansata! and the capricorn symbol within the Lambda! Legio XIIII GMV or II AVG perhaps??

I didn't even realise it had such details!!

Regards,
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