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Greek Helmet Crests
#16
You may be right,Paul.However, even some very early crude corinthians were made of two pieces but the custom did not continue.Here i found some photos of corinthians with ridges and a negau that seems to has the same design to some extend.I find that the original purpose was to protect the joint(even if not seen in other early greek helmets) but this vast continuation into classical times,and the fact that the ridges seem to follow exactly the shape of the crest,makes me believe it had some function concerning the crest,too.
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o118 ... b468_o.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o118 ... 20cb_o.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o118 ... c536_o.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o118 ... uryBCE.jpg

Khairete
Giannis
Giannis K. Hoplite
a.k.a.:Giannis Kadoglou
a.k.a.:Thorax
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#17
Wow Giannis Confusedhock: ! Great collection of helmets!
Virilis / Jyrki Halme
PHILODOX
Moderator
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#18
The big collections are from Olympia.
Giannis K. Hoplite
a.k.a.:Giannis Kadoglou
a.k.a.:Thorax
[Image: -side-1.gif]
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#19
Yes, guy's, I would not rule out the dual purpose of these ridges....we greeks are quite clever you know!!!!
:wink:
Visne partem mei capere? Comminus agamus! * Me semper rogo, Quid faceret Iulius Caesar? * Confidence is a good thing! Overconfidence is too much of a good thing.
[b]Legio XIIII GMV. (Q. Magivs)RMRS Remember Atuatuca! Vengence will be ours!
Titus Flavius Germanus
Batavian Coh I
Byron Angel
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#20
Brooms have stitching or lacing to keep the bristles flat and straight. Might the dots be the knots in a stiffening lace?
Pecunia non olet
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#21
Right,nice idea,never thought of that.But unfortunately they look like dots and rivets than anything else.
look at this one that Paul M attached in one message
http://www.romanarmy.com/rat/viewtopic. ... &start=120
Giannis K. Hoplite
a.k.a.:Giannis Kadoglou
a.k.a.:Thorax
[Image: -side-1.gif]
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#22
Obviously, one can't rule out a 'dual function', but you can see from Giannis' wonderful photos, that the ridges are thick,low, and quite far apart. Unless you postulate very wide/thick crests, the ridges are really too far apart to serve the function of supporting the crest-box - and surely you would make the ridges taller if they were to be of any practical use in supporting a crest-box ?

Incidently, it is apparent that Giannis and others have some truly wonderful photos of helmets etc not generally published.I would love it Big Grin idea: Idea like the Roman helmet typology in the Roman section, as a reference that would benefit all in years to come.

If anyone with good photos of gear/helmets etc were willing to have them copied, I am sure the moderators etc could set up such an archive. As well as helmets it could cover red-figure and other pottery depictions......
"dulce et decorum est pro patria mori " - Horace, ODES
(It is a sweet and proper thing to die for ones country)

"No son-of-a-bitch ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country" -GeorgeC Scott as General George S. Patton
Paullus Scipio/Paul McDonnell-Staff
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#23
It's a good idea.Though I don't know how practical it would be,unless we present only one or two typical examples of each helmet.
I have many photos of helmets mostly I found searching the net for years,and few I took myself.
Giannis K. Hoplite
a.k.a.:Giannis Kadoglou
a.k.a.:Thorax
[Image: -side-1.gif]
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#24
Quote:It's a good idea.Though I don't know how practical it would be,unless we present only one or two typical examples of each helmet.
I have many photos of helmets mostly I found searching the net for years,and few I took myself.

.....there you go !! Would it not be a wonderful thing if the fruits of years of work could be shared ? That way, others would not have to "re-invent the wheel", and the work of you and others could be a strong foundation on which to build a Greek Hopla database - would we include Hellenistic, and greek enemies such as the Persians ? I think we should !
...and no I would not want to see a mere one or two of each type - that has already been done by Snodgrass, Connolly and others. Instead, I would like to see as many as we could get, in all their wonderful variety ( since no two are identical ). Maybe something like Dan Diffendale's Italic helmet database...... Smile D o
"dulce et decorum est pro patria mori " - Horace, ODES
(It is a sweet and proper thing to die for ones country)

"No son-of-a-bitch ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country" -GeorgeC Scott as General George S. Patton
Paullus Scipio/Paul McDonnell-Staff
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#25
Yes,but how can it be done within the borders of RAT?
Dan's site is terrific.I dare say though that the existing photos are hundrets...
Giannis K. Hoplite
a.k.a.:Giannis Kadoglou
a.k.a.:Thorax
[Image: -side-1.gif]
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#26
....let's put the idea to Jasper...he'll be able to tell us if the site can handle it, and how it could be done......will you P.M him or shall I ??
"dulce et decorum est pro patria mori " - Horace, ODES
(It is a sweet and proper thing to die for ones country)

"No son-of-a-bitch ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country" -GeorgeC Scott as General George S. Patton
Paullus Scipio/Paul McDonnell-Staff
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#27
Cool!

I think next year I will visit the NY Museum, its an hour from my family house....will try to take many pictures & anles of these cretans helms & toraxes etc...

I'm still thinking to visit Greece...
  
Remarks by Philip on the Athenian Leaders:
Philip said that the Athenians were like the bust of Hermes: all mouth and dick. 
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#28
Quote:I think next year I will visit the NY Museum, its an hour from my family house....will try to take many pictures & anles of these cretans helms & toraxes etc...
I visited at the beginning of the summer, I've just been too busy to do anything with them yet...
Dan Diffendale
Ph.D. candidate, University of Michigan
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#29
Quote:....let's put the idea to Jasper...he'll be able to tell us if the site can handle it, and how it could be done......will you P.M him or shall I ??

Your idea,Paul,If you haven't done it yet,do it. :wink:
Giannis K. Hoplite
a.k.a.:Giannis Kadoglou
a.k.a.:Thorax
[Image: -side-1.gif]
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#30
Mystery... http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/cgi-bin/im ... 92.07.0280

And still the best explanation is that of John M Roberts, but at least some painters would have depicted short lines or something similar,while all of thwm isnist in dots,and some go even further,depicting little circles.
Giannis K. Hoplite
a.k.a.:Giannis Kadoglou
a.k.a.:Thorax
[Image: -side-1.gif]
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