Attic Helmet assistance, Louvre photos, and modifications

[AntonivsMarivsCongianocvs]

Salve!

I am tackling another aspect of my Roman Tribune/high ranking officer impression, this time the attic helmet.

I've seen a few excellent examples for sale at NIX however; unlike most Deepeka Roman helms, the attic helms are well over $500 and some are as high as $1500: [url:3r8i61jx]http://www.niximperial.biz/collection1.html[/url]

So, as a more affordable (although be it challenging option) I was considering purchasing the deepeeka "Attic Greek" ... adding s visor and crest, cutting and making the visor myself from a sheet of brass; as mentioned on Larp by legio XX [url:3r8i61jx]http://www.larp.com/legioxx/helmets.html[/url]

This is the Deepeeka Attic Greek helm:
[url:3r8i61jx]http://sussen.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/product73.html[/url]

Can anyone post some up close details of the Attic helmets in sculpture from the Louver? This was the best I could find but it's still a bit blurry and I cannot see the front and back, also can anyone please let me know what is on the cheek guard?:



Does anyone have any links to how to emboss brass?

Does anyone thing I’m nuts for even trying this!?!?!? :roll:

Seriously though, I honestly appreciate any assistance you can provide.

Thanks and Vale,
Anthony

[Marcus Mummius]

I'm sure Theodosius here on RAT will be able to offer you some very good advice. He knows a lot about this subject.

The Nix helmets are not very good actually. They are not real metal but some kind of metal dust in epoxy. They are also very weak. I think a reworked metal helmet would be superior to Nix's cold cast stuff.

Vale,

[AntonivsMarivsCongianocvs]

Slave!

Thanks for the thumbs up on modifying the Deepeeka Attic Greek helmet… I just purchased it online and also picked up won a sheet of 18g brass from EBay.

I really want to do some embossing on the helmet but without doing it “Hollywoodâ€

[Dan Diffendale]

Probably a lightning bolt...

[Aurelianus]

lightning bolt!

[AntonivsMarivsCongianocvs]

Slave again,

Is that a lightening bolt like this one? Just without the extra four wings?

The photo in the bottom left here: [url:2smclpvh]http://www.niximperial.biz/c1_2.html[/url]

Sorry but the image is just a bit too large to post (I get an error)

Actually, an eagle 'would' look cooler but, if I'm going to emboss the cheek guards... I want to do it authentically (or at least as authentically as I can) and stay away from the Hollywood cliques.

Does anyone have examples of the décor on the visor?

Thanks,
Anthony

[Tarbicus]

Terry Nix does actually base his own items on actual artefacts or sculpture, as a rule, so the Nix helmet may well be based on the same relief as the subject of this thread, or at least one similar.

[Theodosius the Great]

This was the best I could find but it's still a bit blurry

Sorry Marivs, I promise to take fewer blurry pics in the future :wink:

Okay, here's a nice, big detailed version of the same relief. Now, someone, look me in the eye and tell me this is a figment of some clever artist's imagination :roll:

It looks like there's stitching along the edges of both the cheek piece and the 'visor'.

please let me know what is on the cheek guard

Ah,yes, it's the ubiquitous 'winged lightning bolts' emblem that can be found on many reenactors' shields. You can buy these in brass from Terry Nix for your helmet.

This one and this one are from the more famous relief showing five 'Praetorians'.

Based on the relief Peter Connolly, one of the few artists who've ventured to draw an attic helmet, came up with this.

I'm sure Theodosius here on RAT will be able to offer you some very good advice. He knows a lot about this subject.

Thank you for saying so (:oops: ), but I really don't. I just don't dismiss the helmet as being artistic license.

modifying the Deepeeka Attic Greek helmet… I just purchased it online

I think the bowl is far too domed shaped. Imo, you need a helmet with a flatter curve, like the ones seen in the photo links.

For decorating the 'visor' you should go for an acanthus motif. Google the word to see some examples.

Best of luck.

~Theo

[Tarbicus]

It looks like there's stitching along the edges of both the cheek piece and the 'visor'.

Why would there be stitching on the visor which only has metal behind it? It's the same on the crest mounts.

[Theodosius the Great]

Tarbicus,

Hmm...the crest box does have holes, but don't you see something looking like thread running between the holes on the cheek ? It could be embossed leather decoration sewen onto the metal. The late Roman 'Berkasavo' helmet has a similar feature on it's cheek pieces, except that it's for an interior leather lining. I suppose that's what it could be for this helmet as well.

~Theo

[Marcus Mummius]

I think the holes could well be purely for making shadow/dark zones on the sculpture. Drills were very often used in Roman reliefs for this purpose... So perhaps the holes have nothing to do with the actual construction of the helmet...

[Tarbicus]

Theo is right about the stitching, though. Purely guessing, I'd say the holes on the edges of the rest of the parts other than the cheek piece are cosmetic, simply to make the whole helmet more aesthetically pleasing.

[AntonivsMarivsCongianocvs]

Theodosius, thanks so much for the photos and the links to the acanthus motif!

Quick question, I really like the snake on the cheek guard in the drawing by Peter Connolly… is it the same as this helm you posted[amazon] [url:3mhqly3w]http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y25/RCasti998/Louvre_Right_Large.jpg[/url] I’d really like to take a crack at embossing that snake on my cheek guards.

Also, concerning the holes and the trim… it could be leather wrap from underneath (i.e. helmet padding) or it could be solid gold that might have been bent around and added as trim with the holes hammered to further tally up the aesthetics. (or I could be totally off base!)

Anyways... I’m thinking of possibly embossing a ¼ inch line all around the helmet and then perhaps banging some aesthetic holes in, and gilding it as trim with silver leaf. That might look sweet against the brass.

Well, the helmet’s on its way, just waiting for it to be delivered and the sheet of brass too… I’m sure I’ll have more questions and I’ll be posting idea examples before I do any mods.

Thanks again everyone!

Anthony aka Antonivs[/amazon]

[Theodosius the Great]

You're welcome, Marivs.

Also, concerning the holes and the trim… it could be leather wrap from underneath (i.e. helmet padding) or it could be solid gold that might have been bent around and added as trim with the holes hammered to further tally up the aesthetics. (or I could be totally off base!)

No, I think you're right on. I suspect it's the former option you mentioned because late Roman helmets attach leather liners the same way.

You have great ambitions for your helmet from what I'm hearing so far. You should check out T M Valerius' helmet. He's got a lot of embossing on his Attic (he's from Legion VI).

I hope I can help answer more of your questions in the future.

~Theo

[AntonivsMarivsCongianocvs]

My new Deepeeka Attic Greek is beyond skin tight on me and it’s very frustrating. I’m bending the heck out of it around the ear cut outs (which are way to far forward) trying to get it on… it’s ripping into my ears like crazy… there is simply no room.




I wear a 7 ¾ hat size, my head measures 24â€