"Sign of the beast/corna" in Roman times

[Tarbicus]

Most of us know this favourite gesture of metalheads, but it turns out to have more ancient origins.

The head of the family walked through the house with bare feet at dead of night, making the mystic sign with his first and fourth fingers extended, the other fingers being turned inwards and the thumb crossed over them, in case he might run against an unsubstantial spirit as he moved noiselessly along. This is the sign of "le corna," held to be infallible against the Evil Eye in modern Italy. After solemnly washing his hands, he places black beans in his mouth, and throws others over his shoulders, saying, "With these beans do I redeem me and mine." He repeats this ceremony nine times without looking round, and the spirits are thought to follow unseen and pick up the beans. Then he purifies himself once more and clashes brass, and bids the demons leave his house. When he has repeated nine times "Manes exite paterni," he looks round, and the ceremony is over, and the restless ghosts have been duly laid for a year.

From Greek and Roman Ghost Stories, by Lacey Collison-Morley, available as a text download here:
http://www.archive.org/details/greekandromangho17190gut

[Sergey Lenkov]

It is really traditional Italian gesture - invented by Ronnie James Dio (he is on the photograph). I saw once his interview and he explained that his grandmother did this gesture - as explained in the article - to protect from evil eye. So he stole this idea. But I think that though it is old and Italian gesture - it is not as old as Roman Empire Though - who knows?

[Tarbicus]

Sergey, did you bother to read the book?

It was written in 1912, before there were electric guitars, and the author has written on a number of historical subjects. I doubt RJD's gran walked barefoot through the dead of night performing a magical ritual nine times while doing the sign.

If you have anything to offer to discredit Collison-Morely's work then feel free to do so.

[TITVS SABATINVS AQVILIVS]

[url:1mruuyth]http://www.uni-stuttgart.de/lettres/krueger/extra/josua01.jpg[/url]

[url:1mruuyth]http://www.uni-stuttgart.de/lettres/krueger/extra/ravenna002.jpg[/url]

[url:1mruuyth]http://www.uni-stuttgart.de/lettres/krueger/extra/ravenna005a.jpg[/url]

[url:1mruuyth]http://www.uni-stuttgart.de/lettres/krueger/extra/exorzismus003a.jpg[/url]

[url:1mruuyth]http://www.uni-stuttgart.de/lettres/krueger/extra/noah001a.jpg[/url]

[url:1mruuyth]http://www.uni-stuttgart.de/lettres/krueger/extra/hoernereseldebry01.jpg[/url]

[url:1mruuyth]http://www.uni-stuttgart.de/lettres/krueger/extra/arlecchino001a.jpg[/url]

[Primvs Pavlvs]

Hmm hmm hmm hmm hmm yeah yeah
Holy diver you've been down too long in the midnight sea oh what's becoming of me
Ride the tiger you can see his stripes but you know he's clean oh don't you see what I mean
Gotta get away holy diver yeah
Got shiny diamonds like the eyes of a cat in the black and blue something is coming for you look out
Race for the morning you can hide in the sun 'till you see the light oh we will pray it's all right
Gotta get away get away
Between the velvet lies there's a truth that's hard as steel yeah
The vision never dies life's a never ending wheel say
Holy diver you're the star of the masquerade no need to look so afraid jump jump
Jump on the tiger you can feel his heart but you know he's mean some light can never be seen yeah
Holy diver you've been down too long in the midnight sea oh what's becoming of me no no
Ride the tiger you can see his stripes but you know he's clean oh don't you see what I mean
Gotta get away get away gotta get away get away
Holy diver sole survivor your honour's clean
Holy diver holy diver never cut in the middle comin' after you holy diver
Oh holy diver yeah alright get away get away get away
Holy diver holy diver whoa holy diver hmm hmm hmm hmm

[TITVS SABATINVS AQVILIVS]

[size=59:3fjwq6pf]Psst, in the first pic I posted above, you can see another hand salute on the sarcophagus relief...[/size]

[Ioannis]

Titvs, do you want us to go blind???

:lol:

[Magnus]

There are other uses for this type of gesture as well:

[url:5rnqbnb9]http://www.spideydude.com/spider24.jpg[/url]

[Sergey Lenkov]

Well, it's interesting.
I tried to explain why the man on the photo did this sign

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

Hmmmmmm, who would have guessed the Romans were such big RJD fans! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Seriously though, I am amazed at the number of sayings and guestures and other things that originate from Roman and earlier times, which we take for granted today as cool, or hip things, but whose true origins we are oblivious! hock: hock: 8)

[M. Demetrius]

What about this???
Photoshoppery probably by Laura Sweet.

[Gaivs Antonivs Satvrninvs]

Anyone notice Servilia giving this to Atia along with her curse in last weeks episode of "Rome"?

Judging by the links above it almost looks like the origin of giving the "finger" :roll:

[Tarbicus]

There was a post from a long time ago about a Sicilian tradition of whistling at lightning. It somehow 'feels' right :wink: Anybody know any more about it?

[K. A. Koskinen]

Now this is a bit off-topic, but as I was reading Epitome of Military Science by Vegetius: " Behind all the lines were posted the triarii, armed with shields, cataphracts, helmets, greaves, broadswords, semispathia, lead-weighted darts, and a pair of javelins. They waited in reserve on bended knee, so that in the event of the front lines being defeated, the battle could be restored by them as if anew, and victory retrieved."(II.16.)

So third time's a charm?