Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Merry Christmas!! (A Contrary view)
#16
Quote:I thought, if you'd have problems with anything, you'd just squeeze it to fit

Not only "it", Heiko, also "them" :twisted: !
Virilis / Jyrki Halme
PHILODOX
Moderator
[Image: fectio.png]
Reply
#17
I did not see many problems to simply capitalize terms as Gods or Sun... Since they are sacred terms like the ones of the other religions.

tlclark wrote:

Quote:So if we are going to coin a neologism to describe the vibrant new "Pagan" communities, what term do we use? The new religions are not necessarily ancient paganism.

Neologism? Why? No need. Since I meant the ancient Paganism, the classic one, the ancient and traditional, simply almost everything of religious before Christianism.
Being sticky to the greek/roman polytheism or solar cult, it's the believing of the Gentiles, and existing the term Gentiles, it does not need of any neologism. However, instead of Paganism you can also use "Polytheism", "Solarism", or "Mithraism" since they are aspects of the solar Paganism of Ianus/Quirinus/Saturnus/Iuppiter/Apollo/Helios/Mithra/Sol Inuictus, as well as the polytheism is an aspect of the Solarism, according to the "Neoplatonic" hypostasis hierarchy.

Valete,
TITVS/Daniele Sabatini

... Tu modo nascenti puero, quo ferrea primum
desinet ac toto surget Gens Aurea mundo,
casta faue Lucina; tuus iam regnat Apollo ...


Vergilius, Bucolicae, ecloga IV, 4-10
[Image: PRIMANI_ban2.gif]
Reply
#18
Quote:My advisor routinely asks me to do just this thing, either render all dieties in lower case or all in caps. Somehow it just feels wrong to write "the virigin mary". Confusedhock: so I opt to capitalize everything in my dissertation.

It's the new post-modern trend as well. I don't capitalize Pagan usually because pagan does not describe any specific unified system of beliefs. The pagans of N. Europe are as distinct from the Pagans of the mediterranean as Christians are from Jews. I wouldn't captilize pagan anymore than I would captilize "animism" or "shamanism". These are not unified belief systems but aspects of larger traditions. So in most cases capitalizing "paganism" would be wrong unless you are referring to a specific cult (which I use in the clinically neutral way meaning a system of worship and not the unfortunately derogatory way it is used today) in which case, a more specific term should probably be used.

This is my own approach as well. I would understand "paganism" as an umbrella term encompassing a number of distinct religions (e.g. Wicca, Asatru, and Druidism).

Now, if a person says "I am a Pagan," I would be inclined to capitalize the word in quotation... as it would appear that is the self-identification of their religious faith. However, that would not negate my overall understanding of the term "paganism" as described above. And, of course, all deities should be capitalized, as they are typically proper names (e.g. Jupiter, Mars, Mercury... and of course even such non-planetary entities as Mithras!).
Robert Stroud
The New Scriptorium
Reply
#19
But surely Christian should be christian, until put together with Roman Catholic Christian, or Protestant Christian, or Orthodox Christian, which are to many as different as chalk and cheese.
TARBICvS/Jim Bowers
A A A DESEDO DESEDO!
Reply
#20
religion RELIGION, god(s) GOD(S), atheist ATHEIST, respect RESPECT
Jeffery Wyss
"Si vos es non secui of solutio tunc vos es secui of preciptate."
Reply
#21
Quote:While renewing my feast greetings to all, I just like to see the terms Pagans and Paganism with capital letters like Christianity and Christians. The pagan Gods too with capital letters as all the other Gods are written so today. It's a form of respect due to any religion, don't you think?
Moreover can I suggest to use the term "Gentiles" from "Gens" as a better indicative of the so called Pagans? Because "Paganus" from "pagus" (rural village) was almost exclusively a derogatory term. Since it's from this derivation of "villager" which we have the word "villain", as the expanding Christians called the Pagans of Northern Europe/Scandinavia.
As others mention, "pagan" is a collective term for many religions, it doesn't seem appropriate to treat it as a proper noun. As you note, it's often a derogatory term. I think "polytheist" would be an appropriate non-derogatory alternative -- I don't think "pagan" was used as a derogatory term for competing monotheistic religions. For example, when one branch of Christianity denounced another, practitioners of the other were typically labeled "heretics", not "pagans". And although Mithraists might worship only Mithras, "pagan" would still be an applicable derogatory term, because (as I understand it) they revered Mithras as their favorite god, while a strict monotheist would insist that their deity is the One and Only God, not one of many gods.

If "pagan" refers specifically to the modern religions people call "pagan" today, the proper nouns that apply are "Wicca" and "Neopagan", although "Pagan" is generally understood as a nickname for those sorts of neopagan religion. (I intentionally left that last instance of "neopagan" in lower case, because it was used in the general sense of "modern revivals of polytheistic religions of the past", which includes mainstream Neopagan religion and any other modern revivals.)

If "pagan" refers to the polytheist religion of the Romans before Christianity became the state religion, I've heard the term "Roman State Religion", particularly in reference to the portion that reveres deified emperors as gods. Roman religion also had branches (such as Mithraism), which were compatible with Roman State Religion because they favored specific gods rather than denying all gods other than their own.

__________

Quote:I wonder how much people know (or love to read), that the overall look of the popular modern 'Santa' was created by a soft drink company long ago... :lol:
That's wrong, according to Snopes. Although Coca Cola popularized the red-and-white Santa Claus to the point that competing images largely disappeared, that image isn't their creation.
Reply
#22
To allthe RATers who read this, I would like to extend my wishes that you all have a Mwerry Christmas/Saturnalia/Haneka...... or whatever! :lol:

I finally have work to go to after sitiing in despondancy for almost 8weeks!
Thought my big mouth had finally bitten me in the A## !

Hopefully, will get on before New Years, as this forum is full of interesting articles/opinions/information/people! :wink: But if not, have a Happy New Year Too!

Regards
Visne partem mei capere? Comminus agamus! * Me semper rogo, Quid faceret Iulius Caesar? * Confidence is a good thing! Overconfidence is too much of a good thing.
[b]Legio XIIII GMV. (Q. Magivs)RMRS Remember Atuatuca! Vengence will be ours!
Titus Flavius Germanus
Batavian Coh I
Byron Angel
Reply
#23
Quote:If "pagan" refers to the polytheist religion of the Romans before Christianity became the state religion, I've heard the term "Roman State Religion", particularly in reference to the portion that reveres deified emperors as gods. Roman religion also had branches (such as Mithraism), which were compatible with Roman State Religion because they favored specific gods rather than denying all gods other than their own.

Good points. Laudes.

It also should be pointed out that neat divisions only matter to Christians and later groups. Pagans weren't nearly as fussy so maybe dividing them is wrong in the first place!

Trav
Theodoros of Smyrna (Byzantine name)
aka Travis Lee Clark (21st C. American name)

Moderator, RAT

Rules for RAT:
<a class="postlink" href="http://www.romanarmy.com/rat/viewtopic.php?Rules">http://www.romanarmy.com/rat/viewtopic.php?Rules for posting

Oh! and the Toledo helmet .... oh hell, forget it. :? <img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_confused.gif" alt=":?" title="Confused" />:?
Reply
#24
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jh ... apan20.xml

A great article that illustrates my earlier points. Cultures adopt all sorts of things from each other, often not caring what about their underlying meaning.
Theodoros of Smyrna (Byzantine name)
aka Travis Lee Clark (21st C. American name)

Moderator, RAT

Rules for RAT:
<a class="postlink" href="http://www.romanarmy.com/rat/viewtopic.php?Rules">http://www.romanarmy.com/rat/viewtopic.php?Rules for posting

Oh! and the Toledo helmet .... oh hell, forget it. :? <img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_confused.gif" alt=":?" title="Confused" />:?
Reply
#25
tlclark wrote:

Quote:Cultures adopt all sorts of things from each other, often not caring what about their underlying meaning.

I don't think that be good for a people. Like in the biodiversity (as you know, biodiversity is often a measure of the health of biological systems to indicate the degree to which the aggregate of historical species are viable versus extinct), it's the same to me for the culture-diversity: milkshakes, even if good at the moment, can't give long term benefits to the taste, since you don't know the ingredients anymore and why you use them. Correct and good cooking provides in fact for recognizing any ingredient. :wink:

Vale,
TITVS/Daniele Sabatini

... Tu modo nascenti puero, quo ferrea primum
desinet ac toto surget Gens Aurea mundo,
casta faue Lucina; tuus iam regnat Apollo ...


Vergilius, Bucolicae, ecloga IV, 4-10
[Image: PRIMANI_ban2.gif]
Reply
#26
Quote:But surely Christian should be christian, until put together with Roman Catholic Christian, or Protestant Christian, or Orthodox Christian, which are to many as different as chalk and cheese.
Not really. The religion or faith is Christian. The adjective identifies denominational association, liturgical tradition, theological preference, etc. When people ask my "religion" (which is even listed on my dog tags), I always respond "Christian." Then I say, "what you probably really want to know is my denominational preference, right?"

Now, as to the diversity of Christian denominations, you're right. There are many. A person who thinks all Christians are alike makes the same error as does an individual who believes all Pagans worship the same deities.
Robert Stroud
The New Scriptorium
Reply
#27
Quote:Now, as to the diversity of Christian denominations, you're right. There are many. A person who thinks all Christians are alike makes the same error as does an individual who believes all Pagans worship the same deities.
That is very true.....when you consider that the faiths called Christianity, Judaism and Islam have many of the same characters, prophets, angels etc....one split came with Christ and another with Mohammed a few hundred years later... All lit from the same ancient candle, so to speak ....!
As far as Christianity goes, (in England) one split at the Synod of Whitby in 664ce another split with Henry VIII around 900 years later.....:wink:
Thinking about it, Roman Catholics are actually not monotheist as such...they have a family...ie..God the father, Mary the mother and Jesus the son and the image of the Madonna and child. Orthodox Christian religions also use icons of the Madonna and child, which is not used in other branches of the Christian faith....!
Incidentially Asatru/Odinism/Vanatru etc, come under the heading of 'Heathen' not Pagan......lol
Test your knowledge of Gods, myths and polytheist religion here Choose from Celtic, Norse,Roman, Hellenic and Egyptian ..... Big Grin
regards
Arthes
Cristina
The Hoplite Association
[url:n2diviuq]http://www.hoplites.org[/url]
The enemy is less likely to get wind of an advance of cavalry, if the orders for march were passed from mouth to mouth rather than announced by voice of herald, or public notice. Xenophon
-
Reply
#28
Quote:Incidentially Asatru/Odinism/Vanatru etc, come under the heading of 'Heathen' not Pagan.....
Now, "Heathen" is a loaded word. If someone thinks "Pagan" is prejudicial or judgmental, most of the folks I know would consider "Heathen" ten times moreso...

Thanks for the link. I'll check it out after Christmas.
Robert Stroud
The New Scriptorium
Reply


Possibly Related Threads…
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Merry Christmas! Flavivs Aetivs 4 2,262 12-27-2015, 11:56 PM
Last Post: Robert Vermaat
  Merry Christmas Aryan Steels 10 2,109 12-26-2014, 04:41 PM
Last Post: Macedon
  Merry Christmas Aryan Steels 32 4,876 01-01-2014, 07:36 AM
Last Post: Epictetus

Forum Jump: