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Certainly we all use substitutes, there's no choice because completely accurate materials are often simply not available, but I don't see that the choice usually sacrifices function for appearance. Can you give examples if you think this is the case? Because usually, I think anyway, the substitutes aren't chosen specifically for their appearance, but because they're the closest we can get. So if the material is as close to the real thing as it can be, it ought to necessarily be as close in functional characteristics as well.
Specifically what functions are you meaning anyway?
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Hib, given the overwhelming consensus that CR is by far the best choice, in terms of pretty much everything, that would preclude anything else being used.
Why not use 1090 carbon steel instead? Or maybe pure titanium...I'm sure with some sand paper you can bring out a nice finish in either metal.
Suggesting another material as a question points to a want or desire to use it, even if it's just a thought. Otherwise, why would it have come up? What if someone who is looking for information on building segmentata came across this thread, checks out your website, then decides to build one out of stainless steel plates?
The exercise in even considering stainless is even more pointless, when you realize that it doesn't have one advantage over using cold rolled low carbon steel. We don't need to find another material because we have one that fits the requirements perfectly.
In the case of clothes and fabrics, we're sometimes forced by cost or availability to adapt or improvise. But that's not the case with CR mild steel...that's probably the most common type of steel to come by. You'd have to go to a metal oriented store to get stainless in sheet, whereas most hardware stores sell sheets in various gauge of cold rolled.
So just because you can make it look like CR...what's the validity in doing so? Should we then use electroplated, white metal cast helmets because we can make them look like the real thing at 90 feet away?
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Magnus/Matt
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CR stands for Carbon something? What does it mean? Sorry for my ignorance...
![[Image: 120px-Septimani_seniores_shield_pattern.svg.png]](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e2/Septimani_seniores_shield_pattern.svg/120px-Septimani_seniores_shield_pattern.svg.png) ![[Image: Estalada.gif]](http://webs.racocatala.cat/esteladaanimada/Estalada.gif)
Ivan Perelló
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Flaventius.... CR is a shape forming process.. cold rolled... most CR steel is low carbon, sometimes called commercial steel or mild steel.
Hibernicus
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I understand. Thanks Hibernicus!!!
[size=75:2rctpppu]BTW... is my Roman name that difficult?!?! :wink: :lol:  wink: [/size]
Ivan Perelló
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BTW... is my Roman name that difficult?!?!
No, but my eyes are old and I type with three thumbs and seven other digits that have other ideas of what keys to use and when to use them.. ...or somehting like that.. 'sides key boards are too small... these thick padded digits of mine trying to use a keyboard designed for the dainty fingered among us....
I drive spell checkers batty!
Hibernicus
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Quote:Its why I ask all our soldiers to hammer work their CR steel for segmentatas.. yeah, we'll have unhammered segs around for years... but, eventually they too will fade away.... relegated to a collection and dust or loaner kit and rust...
Once again you're presuming hammered plate is somehow more correct than rolled despite evidence to the contrary- in their article In defense of Rome: a metallographic investigation of Roman ferrous armour from Northern Britain (Journal of Archaeological Science 32 (2005) 241-250)Fulford, et al. present evidence that a fragment of lorica from Vindolanda could have indeed been formed by cold rolling. What their investigation shows is that a wide variety of practices were used to make armor- folding and forge-welding, decaburisation, work-hardening, and rolling. So if you want to consider hammered plate 'an option' as you did previously, that's reasonable, however suggesting that cold rolled metal is not appropriate by saying you'll only be keeping the rolled metal segmentatae around as loaners or dust collectors is wrong.
And your basic thesis for this and the other thread is that there's a significant amount of alternate materials used that sacrifice function for form, and I asked for examples- I trust you'll do so before too many replies arrive in your thread about that subject- you're supposed to have that information already, yes?
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"Once again you're presuming hammered plate is somehow more correct than rolled despite evidence to the contrary- in their article In defense of Rome: a metallographic investigation of Roman ferrous armour from Northern Britain (Journal of Archaeological Science 32 (2005) 241-250)Fulford, et al. present evidence that a fragment of lorica from Vindolanda could have indeed been formed by cold rolling. What their investigation shows is that a wide variety of practices were used to make armor- folding and forge-welding, decaburisation, work-hardening, and rolling. "
Could you quote the article, please. You've citied the article before in regard to cold rolling. This is new to me, as have been many things related to Roman arms and armor over the years! I've never been one to not absorb new info and incorporate it!
Hibernicus
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Check this out:
[url:27blk23q]http://www.romanarmy.com/rat/viewtopic.php?p=60847#60847[/url]
TARBICvS/Jim Bowers
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Quote:BTW... is my Roman name that difficult?!?!
No, but my eyes are old and I type with three thumbs and seven other digits that have other ideas of what keys to use and when to use them.. ...or somehting like that.. 'sides key boards are too small... these thick padded digits of mine trying to use a keyboard designed for the dainty fingered among us....
I drive spell checkers batty!
Nevermind... I was just kidding :wink: .
Ivan Perelló
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