Question: Shields under the Migration Period.

[Martin Wallgren]

What is the common thought on the size and form of shields from the Migrationperiod (300-700 AD). When you look at reconstruktions one often see oval shields. What was the most common shape and size in scandinavia during this period? Is there anyone who have suggestions or pics of finds from the Vendelperiod graves?

Need some information for a reconstruction so I´m greatful for answers.

[Carlton Bach]

All Vendel period references I have seen to date were round, but that doesn't mean much. I don't think we have surviving shields. Now, the finds from Nydam and Gokstad indicate tzhat there was a continuous tradition in Scandinavia of flat, round shields while the evidence from southerly parts shows that dished shields were at least known (and I am *so* not going to argue common/uncommon). The Sutton Hoo shield, allegely Scandinavian-influenced, too, was round (and flat, at least that's what the British museum thinks).

Oval shields most often show up in images from Late Roman sources. Most later Migration-era pics (Carolingian, Anglo-Saxon and such) show fairly clearly circular shields, though in some cases especially in the 9th and 10th centuries, oval makes a comeback). It has been argued that oval shields are just a misrepresentation of circular ones, a misguided attempt at foreshortening. I'm not the expert on that, you had better ask Vortigern Studies or Aitor there. BUt it is very likely Late Rokman shields were (at least at times) curved or dished, whereas north European shields seem to have been mostly flat.

And when you get to Pictish or Irish shields, all bets are off. They're just weird.

I have fresh pics of the Nydam shields, BTW. If you want them, drop me a line with your e-mail.

[Martin Wallgren]

Thanks!

my mail is wallgrenmartin(AT)hotmail(DOT)com

I´ve seen some reconstruktions at the museum in Gamla Uppsala of the vendel/valsgärde shields but that was quite vague and didn´t say much. It was a frame that showd how big they thought the shield was and the buckle in the middle and some rivets and small pieses of wood.

[Peroni]

Ask Volker (Carlton Bach) for a set of his excellent photographs of the shields from the Nydam deposit.

He sent me a set today and they are fantastic!

Regards,

[Carlton Bach]

Thanks!

my mail is wallgrenmartin(AT)hotmail(DOT)com

I´ve seen some reconstruktions at the museum in Gamla Uppsala of the vendel/valsgärde shields but that was quite vague and didn´t say much. It was a frame that showd how big they thought the shield was and the buckle in the middle and some rivets and small pieses of wood.

PIctures are on their way.

BTW, you may want to consider changing your mail address to Name(AT)provider.country so the spambiots can't read it. at least unless you *want* all those poffers for physical augmentation and/or business opportunities in Africa.

[Martin Wallgren]

Thanx a million for the Pictures... Fantastic.

Martin

[FAVENTIANVS]

http://membres.lycos.fr/bronzeage/iron_age/index.html

From http://membres.lycos.fr/bronzeage/

[Martin Wallgren]

Many Thanx to all!

I´m very greatful

[aitor iriarte]

Hi Martin,
We all agree on late Roman (IV-Vth century) being either round or oval. We don't agree about 'statistics'. i.e. I think that most shields were already round, while others (Christian, Robert) think that most shields were still oval... :roll:
We all agree on most if not all shields being dished, like the sloping collars on most shield bosses clearly prove.
If the Migration Period (broadly speaking, Thorsberg, Nydam...) actual surviving shield boards are now flat, it is due to terrain pressure. The shield bosses denote that they were originally dished. The sixth century board remains from Egypt now in Trier are dished too.
About the Sutton Hoo shield, at the BM reconstructed it as an ugly and strange hybrid compromise between a flat central section and a sloping rim, but the umbo's flange is sloping too and they were forced to insert an odd ring-like feature under it to make it fit their 'flat' board.

Aitor

[Martin Wallgren]

Hi Aitor!

Thank you for the answer!

My main aim for this project is to do a early Vendelperiod shield so the info on the Sutton Hoo is realy good. The timeframe I am thinking of is around 500 AD to 580 AD.

Would a good suggestion be a round shield around 80cm in diameter that is slightly dished? Could it be an oval shield and would that be sloped too?

And what size is the general suggestion here?

I have tried to do comparisons between finds and contemporary art from engravings on helmets and stones. Most are younger (700AD - 1100AD) and they are in Scandinavia only round as far as I have seen. The sizes I´ve estemated are between 55cm / to 90cm.

More oppinions are appresiated.

Martin

[aitor iriarte]

My pleasure, Martin!
By the sixth century, only round shields are recorded and all the Vendel shields were round, as their surviving (more or less) 'in situ' metallic fitings denote. There is a good study on the final publication of the Sutton Hoo burial, comprising several of the Vendel period shields. I'l try to have a look at it along these days... :wink:

Aitor