shield shape

[Opifex]

Ave!

I try to cut my new thracian shield, but I am not 100% sure what kind of shapes are perfectly authentic.
I know that the thracian shileds (kind of parma) were roundish or polygonal.
My idea is a octogonal shield which not flat but curved as the scutums are.
Is it ok?
Thanks a lot!

I also would apriciate if anybody could link some photos/pictures/drawings about it.

[Medusa Gladiatrix]

According to Marcus Junkelmann the shield of the thraex - which is called parmula - is rectangular like a shortened scutum. It's not 100 % square though but no other shape than four-cornered.

[Medusa Gladiatrix]

Here are two photos of a little thraex statuette which I have taken at the Kestner Museum in Hannover. This statuette is made out of bronze and approx. 9.5 cm high. I think it clearly shows the size and shape of the parmula of this type of gladiator.

[Felix]

Very nice pictures, Gaia!

a mosaic of a Thracian who has discarded his shield: http://penelope.uchicago.edu/~grout/enc ... hraex.html

[Opifex]

Thanks a lot for everybody.
Here is my new thracian shield.
I found this painting on an auxiliares shield.

[Tarbicus]

I had problems with your initial link. Here's a direct link:
[url:2q7beyqm]http://www.opifex.ingyenweb.hu/gladiator/parma_1.jpg[/url]

No, it's gone again :?

Nice shield though! Added as an attchment.

[Robert Vermaat]

Nope...

[Tarbicus]

Bizarre! I uploaded as an attachment from my machine, but it still has that logo instead hock:

Host bypassed completely this time.

[Robert Vermaat]

I can see your attachment, but original link and image go that grey logo...

Oddly enough, it worked here when I changed the image for a link: http://www.romanarmy.com/rat/viewtopic.php?t=7928

[Martin Moser]

Nice shield, but I doubt the shield boss on a Thraex shield (sorry :oops: ...). Just checked a number of depictions and statuetes and where the shield is clearly visible I could not find anything like a shield boss.
A few depictions show the the shield from the back side, btw, mostly with a vertical grip, although the little statuette posted by Gaia Aelia above has a horizontal one as far as I can make out.

[M. Demetrius]

So if no boss on the parmula, it must be that either
1) the curve is much deeper (shorter radius) than a typical scutum, and has a horizontal grip, which would allow for knuckle room between the grip and the inside surface, or
2) the handle is a "c" shaped, or "luggage" handle type, which could be either vertical or horizontal, or
3) what else?

I'm about to make one of these.

Does anybody have representative dimensions? I'm surmising from photos, etc., that the width around the curve is probably 24-28", and the height something like 32". Is that about right? I'm 6 ft tall.

Vespa

[Medusa Gladiatrix]

I referred once again to my "bible" of gladiatorial things, i.e. the book by Marcus Junkelmann.

He describes the parmula having is 60 x 60 cm (sorry, I don't know how many inches that is, hope you have a conversion table somewhere). Since it has a curvature the chord is then between 50-55 cm, depending on the grade of the curvature. Junkelmann prefers after trials a vertical handle, which is in contrary to the little statuette of which I had taken pics. The French authors Eric Teyssier and Brice Lopez show in their book "Gladiateurs - Des Sources à l'Experimentation" a reconstruction also with a vertical handle. Maybe both version are possible and maybe it depends on the fighter which way he prefers.

[M. Demetrius]

Hmm. 60cm is just under 24" (2.54cm= 1 inch) That's about what I had in mind, so my guess wasn't far off of the real thing.

I've used both vertical and horizontal grips in mock combat, and for carrying longish distances. I highly prefer the horizontal, since the hand is able to relax more while walking with the horizontal.

With the vertical, it's necessary to keep tension with the thumb side of the wrist all the time, while just hooked fingers is enough to carry the horizontal. I imagine it was mostly preference. Although with a deep curve like the Thraex, it would be much more difficult to use the shield rotated 90 degrees, so it's problematic. Preference, as you say, is probably the order of business. I don't think the individual gladiator had much to say about it, though, it's not like his life expectancy was all that long anyhow. Few ever saw their own rudis.

[Medusa Gladiatrix]

In contrary to legionaries gladiators didn't need to carry their shields on long marches. The only needed to wear their gear for a fight which is estimated to last the longest between 10-15 min.

Also it is a common disbelief that most gladiators lost their lives in the arena, for detailed information see this thread which will lead you also to another thread where this topic has been discussed in detail:
http://www.romanarmy.com/rat/viewtopic.php?t=8844

As you could see many gladiators lived long enough and even became stars so they definitely could make adjustments to their gear or ask the armorer to do so.

Anyhow, it seems like it's more or less speculation if the grip was vertical or horizontal. The statuette of my picture shows a horizontal grip, maybe someone else here could provide us with a different image of a thraex which shows a vertical grip. I would therefore say, do it as it is more comfortable for you.

[Opifex]

Ave!

Martin: I think that some of the thracian shields hade boss as well. Please find below some mosaics and statues as the base of my shield.
Please tell me if I am wrong, as we try to be 100% authentic.
http://opifex.ingyenweb.hu/keret.cgi?/g ... thrak1.jpg
http://opifex.ingyenweb.hu/keret.cgi?/g ... thrak2.jpg
http://opifex.ingyenweb.hu/keret.cgi?/g ... thrak3.jpg
http://opifex.ingyenweb.hu/keret.cgi?/g ... thrak4.jpg


Opifex