Music of Ancient Rome and Greece

[Peter Raftos]

What a wonderful thread Thank you all. I am curious about the actual construction of ancient instruments. Are there makers around? Are there and good references. I am aware that the late great Mr Marshall’s Ancestral Instruments used to sell a diaulos, Alas no longer.

Philip Neuman of the musical group De Organographia has written a great article for Didaskalia about the aulos from the performers point of view ( See http://www.didaskalia.net/issues/vol2no2/neuman.html ) which discusses their construction.

Have the other luminaries of ancient musical instrument making ( John Curtis Franklin, Panayiotis Stefos, Ioannidis Nikolaos, Elena Stoynova or Nicholas Brass) produced any publications that discuss the construction of ancient instruments for re-enactor types that would like to make them?

[Susanna]

I know John Curtis Franklin very good, but I never heared him of building any instruments himself ;-) )
Alas, most of the digital work he does are recorded sounds from instruments that were built by us... :wink:

My husband builts many instruments, but he has a list for the next year with orders. Also, we are now building Aulos made from Bronze and Bone...but at the moment for ourselves.

I am not sure, if all this persons are instrument-builders themselves. Especially I think there are only a few persons worldwide who would build good Aulos (there is still so much discussion and so much that we do not know for sure).

For start training it might be helpful to use two playing pipes of a bagpipe with double-reeds...I mean its fake, but you will start to get a feeling for the playing technique...with that I could help you find a proper builder.

[Sergey Lenkov]

Hello, Susanna!
Check out private messages.

[Peter Raftos]

Many thanks Susanna

[Sergey Lenkov]

More thanks!

[Ebusitanus]

I received today (and I´m now listening) to "Symphonia Panica" and while the instruments are great I do not see why so much criticism is heaped upon other "less serious" groups when this CD is also full of "modern" sounding rithms that make it also sound catchy. Tracks 4 and 6 specially. One of them sounds like a Peruvian remake of "El condor pasa".

Do not get me wrong, I like it VERY much, but having read this thread, Marshall, Omnia, Synaulia, Ludi Scaenici sound as good as this.

[Sergey Lenkov]

Well, but here (on CD by Musica Romana) you have some really authentic pieces - and you are informed about their origin and the origin of composed by Musica Romana pieces. I wrote here that of course it would be interesting if CD were longer with more authentic pieces.
Omina is a folk rock music - in that sense you could listen to Dead Can Dance, soundtracks of "Alexander", "Gladiator" - and think that it is also ancient music . I like it (not Omnia), I`m a real fan of Vangelis and Lisa Gerrard - but they are not re-creating and restorating music from the ancient sources.
Well, nodody told here that Ludi Scaenici and Synaulia are playng bad music, and that you should throw away their CDs, they are very good, but as example Synaulia plays completely, completely modern music. It gives us a chance to listen to the sound of the ancient instruments, not to ancient music itself.
My opinion is - listen to all that possible and make your own choice - each record got its own faults - and own gems. And the process of research in this field of music is still developing - so probably we would never hear such ideal performance of Mesomedos as Glenn Gould`s versions of the music by Bach.

[Ebusitanus]

Well...there are actually several tracks on Omnia that actually comparning it to the "modern" beats I can also hear at "Musica Romana" I would not put in any less. Each of these groups has tracks which one could find "modern" sounding (instruments reconstruction apart) and Symphonia Panica, while I DO like it very much, has also several of those. The same can be said about Ludi Scaenici and Synaulia or even Marshall´s excellent CD. Omnia, as you say, is more folk without remorse but several of his pieces are very decent sounding. Musica Romana has great tracks but also those that sound modern and even medieval.

Looking forward on the upcomming "Musica Romana Life" CD.

[Susanna]

Hi Daniel,

*back from Austria and Hungary from several concerts*

cool that you received it and all good well ;-) )

We are happy, if you like it!

Well, antique music HAS modern rhytms which we know throw writings.
Also the ancient composition.

What I mainly critised are the reconstructions and names given to the ancient instruments. Most of the reconstructions are technically wrong are did not exist in that form (e.a. double-flutes, cithara with soundholes etc.), cause it should give an "authentic sound". I know its difficult to hear a difference, but it is there...f.e. compare Marshalls and our Aulos with that of Ludi Scaenici and Synaulia that is the difference between double- and single-reeds (which we do not have any proof for).

Can you read the booklet, it would also help to compare and inform!?
*Gosh* I think we really need an English Version and of course, people who own the German version then will get the English Booklet, too.
But I do not think I will be ready with it before the beginning of the next year...first my son will arrive in 2 weeks and my belly does not fit in front of the computer anymore ;-) )


So, just you may ask anything about the CD here, what you do not get in the booklet and I will translate it as good as I can.
:wink:

Thanks Sergey...!

Regards,
Susanna

[Ebusitanus]

Hello Susana,
The more I listen to it the more I like it and I do hope you will make more CDs. Specially I liked the last track when all you girls sing
Who are you btw? First, second or last?
I read the booklet and found it very informative.

[Susanna]

The first... wink:

The Live-Album "Cave Carmen" was already recorded last December on the radio while broadcasted also.
During the winter I will write the booklet and then release it.

We are also planning of putting two other programms on CD.
One very modern and one with a very special instrument... :wink:

[Sergey Lenkov]

God bless, Susanna!

As to English translation in the booklets - it is really necessary. I wrote one scientific book (not on Ancient world history) and didn`t make an English summary in the end. I thought - it would be interesting only for Russian readers. Now I understands that I was wrong.
I obtained one more CD - "Palastinelied" in which performers of Emmuty Records participated. I`m very impressed (for other visitors - it is medieval song from the time of Crusades spanning for 30 minutes performed in different manners by 20 authentic and rock performers) - but situation is the same - very impressive and original record - and no any information in English.
Why do you think that your music is interesting only for German speaking listeners? Your auditory is much wider - just help these people to know more about you and your work!

[Susanna]

The "Palaestina Song" thinnie project was done five years ago and some of our musicans participated. But the whole thing was done by somebody different...
the problem is that we do not find an international distributor, we only have one for Germany, Belgium, Netherlands, Switzerland and Austria.
They say we are too specialized for a big audience and there is no money for advertisment...no advertisment...no selling...
and to print an English Version for 100 people is too much money for us to spend at the moment.
So we will see...it is not that we are not willing to... :wink:

By the way...seems we have a water-organ now together with new guest musicians at Musica Romana. With real water tanks, not only with an air-pump. More informations are availible after November, I think. :wink:

[Ebusitanus]

Susanna, you mentioned a new CD comming out this summer. Am I to understand that this is the same one you are writting the booklet for a 2007 distribution? Quite some delay, no?

[Susanna]

Hi Daniel,

normally it would have been released this summer...but then the little thinnie that is still in my belly (my first son "Severin") crossed my plans. :wink:
But this is a kind of problem with plans I would not like to miss...

So, because I am also writing about my University Work about "Gallo-Roman Panfluit finds" which have to be ready in six weeks.

After that I will try to work on the German Booklet for the Live-CD as soon as I can to release it still during winter. Maybe I directly write it in German/English, I have to see. :wink: