01-24-2017, 08:40 PM
Hi All,
New member of the forum here, my main area of interest is Republican Roman history, I stop paying attention once Augustus sets himself up. without the politics of the republic, I find the history of empire to be quite 'flat', plus all the main conquests are Republican!. Also have a minor interest in Classical through to Hellenistic periods, again the political wranglings.
Enough with quick into and onto my main aspect of this thread...
Manipular legion: class or experience based?
You often read that the Hastati, Principes, Triarii were divided based on class/wealth and experience grounds. With the Hastati being poorer & least experience through to Triarii being wealthy & experienced. However, it doesn't seem possible to divide a group by both criteria, as there will be a mix of experience across all classes. - That means that you need to either group them by wealth OR by experience.
I'll attribute this to the fact that over the course of the 100's of years Manipular legions were marching around things probably changed. So it would make sense that from the time of the kingdom, the army would be organised by wealth - ability to afford equipment being crucial (and common in other city states). While, as the Roman military machine became more mature, changed this to a division based on experience. But I would be happy to defer this to the more knowledgeable folks here.
Assuming this, leads me to two additional questions:
Thanks,
the_gracchi
New member of the forum here, my main area of interest is Republican Roman history, I stop paying attention once Augustus sets himself up. without the politics of the republic, I find the history of empire to be quite 'flat', plus all the main conquests are Republican!. Also have a minor interest in Classical through to Hellenistic periods, again the political wranglings.
Enough with quick into and onto my main aspect of this thread...
Manipular legion: class or experience based?
You often read that the Hastati, Principes, Triarii were divided based on class/wealth and experience grounds. With the Hastati being poorer & least experience through to Triarii being wealthy & experienced. However, it doesn't seem possible to divide a group by both criteria, as there will be a mix of experience across all classes. - That means that you need to either group them by wealth OR by experience.
I'll attribute this to the fact that over the course of the 100's of years Manipular legions were marching around things probably changed. So it would make sense that from the time of the kingdom, the army would be organised by wealth - ability to afford equipment being crucial (and common in other city states). While, as the Roman military machine became more mature, changed this to a division based on experience. But I would be happy to defer this to the more knowledgeable folks here.
Assuming this, leads me to two additional questions:
- If the Hastati, Principes and Triarii were experience based in later armies - then quality of their equipment would vary considerably within the each grouping, rather than between grouping as is commonly thought of, and shown in modern artwork, games, tv etc. e.g. Hastati in pectorals, while Principles in lorica hamata.
- Experienced Triarii - who would have gained this experience (in later armies) with a sword, would then fight the rest of their campaign days with a spear. Would they really have given up the weapon that did them good service thus far to adopt a new weapon? It would make sense to me that by the time of experience based system comes into practice, the sword and pilum would be the standard panoply of the Triarii too?
Thanks,
the_gracchi