Roman Army before and after the Marius' Reforms

[JaM]

Hastati, Principes, and Triari/Pilani were not composed of all eligible citizens. Because you're not including the other military roles that citizens played in the Roman army, namely cavalry and skirmishers, which according to both Polybius and Livy were manned by specific social economic classes.

i was talking specifically about INFANTRY... excluding cavalry... so where exactly made i mistake? i dont think i did - Hastati, Principes and Triarii were all selected from citizens ELIGIBLE FOR INFANTRY SERVICE..  not Cavalry, not officers... INFANTRY.. Pedites/Milites, whatever you want to call them. And there is no historical mention that Class 1 were only Triarii, or Class V were Velites or Hastati or whatever. Only mention we have is about the AGE those men..   I really dont care if Class I-V were called Middle class or not, its not the main thing i wanted to point out. again, my whole point was towards no equipment difference between HASTATI, PRINCIPES and TRIARII besides the use of Hasta by the Triarii.  I made that comment, because it is very common for people to quote Polybius and say things he never wrote, like for example that Hastati used only Pectorales, or Triarii had Bronze Breastplates same as officers.. yet no such thing was ever mentioned by Polybius.

Brian, it doesnt matter how you call it.. there is no mention of let say Class I only forming Triarii, or Class V only forming Hastati... Hastati, Principes and Triarii were composed of all eligible citizens. Thats what im trying to say from the beginning.. if i used middle class term, it was just to point out these were not proletearii or patricians/equestrians. they were in the middle of these two groups, which btw neither were actually serving as infantry anyway.

Of course that later, when Census requirements were reduced, or completely removed, Proletarii were recruited who had no chance to get any kind of armor. They had to rely what Republic provided. Even when Rome "drafted" slaves or anybody willing after Cannae, these men were told to be equipped with equipment taken from temples.. yet again, it was not the norm, even later on, otherwise Caesar would not mentioned Expediti/Antesignani to put down their heavy armor so they would be not encumbered and could effectively fight off faster gauls..

and on another topic, yes i believe that Triarii were not actually something special, they were reservist force composed of oldest eligible men but no longer seen as reliable for front rank combat. if anybody was seen as "elite" it was Principes - "the first men", who were supposed to decide the battle.

Also, i believe Servilan army was describing the Hoplitic formation Romans used, and as such it was oriented more towards wealth, same as with Greeks. But, once Romans adopted more open Manipular tactics, they also adopted new distribution of men based on actual combat stamina (based on age), as their whole new combat tactics evolved around notion to tire enemy down through battle of fatigue attrition. This tactics called for most fittest to fight it, therefore oldest were kept in reserve so they could preserve their strength to the point they were really needed.