Quote:I've come across the idea that his Phoenician name "Abdes" means "servant of Isis" but this could mean nothing. I've also read that at least sometimes temple slaves weren't actually slaves but serfs working on temple estates and as servants to priests and other officials.
'Abdes' may be just a name with no significance to be attached to its underlying meaning. Alternatively, it could simply mean that he was a worshipper of Isis, without implying that he had any direct connection with the temple as servant or in any other capacity.
Michael King Macdona
And do as adversaries do in law, -
Strive mightily, but eat and drink as friends.
(The Taming of the Shrew: Act 1, Scene 2)
Anne Ching post=361578 Wrote:I've come across the idea that his Phoenician name "Abdes" means "servant of Isis" but this could mean nothing. I've also read that at least sometimes temple slaves weren't actually slaves but serfs working on temple estates and as servants to priests and other officials.
'Abdes' may be just a name with no significance to be attached to its underlying meaning. Alternatively, it could simply mean that he was a worshipper of Isis, without implying that he had any direct connection with the temple as servant or in any other capacity.
He could have been from a family who worshipped Isis. In fact that's probably the most logical explanation for the name; I think it was his given name.
I didn't want to start a whole new thread on a question related to this topic, so I'm posting my new one here (I'm much further along in the first draft than I was when I posted the OP)
This is actually not exactly about the topic as such but is tangentially related.
What is/are the object(s) in the Pantera statue's hand?
A novel in the form of either a diary or letters-sent-home has a huge disadvantage. It can only show the thoughts of the writer. As such, exposition becomes very awkward. Perhaps it's not my place to suggest it, but maybe you should consider the "third person omnipotent." This will relieve you from tight quarters and open up the story, basically a "God's eye view." I have read and reviewed novels written by other RAT members, and I find the "first person" clumsy, especially when the story is placed in an era unfamiliar to present-day readers. If you wish, send me a PM and I can email a PDF of a historical novel written in the omnipotent style. ;-)
Alan J. Campbell
member of Legio III Cyrenaica and the Uncouth Barbarians
Author of:
The Demon's Door Bolt (2011)
Forging the Blade (2012)
"It's good to be king. Even when you're dead!"
Old Yuezhi/Pazyrk proverb
Quote:My guess is that it would be a scroll but it is badly eroded.
It actually looks like he's holding a bird (with his hand wrapped around its body and the head sticking up) mile:
[attachment=11801]pantera.jpg[/attachment]
But that would be fanciful. I agree with Michael - it's probably a scroll or other document relating to the citizenship he was granted on discharge from the army.
(* Unless he really was a standard bearer, and this is some part of the standard he's holding!...)
I would posit that if a soldier wanted to chronicle his experience in real time, he might consider letters home to be the obvious medium in which to do it. But I also don't find it THAT unlikely that one soldier would keep a diary. Its certainly less likely that he actually existed.
Quote:Hi, Annie
A novel in the form of either a diary or letters-sent-home has a huge disadvantage. It can only show the thoughts of the writer. As such, exposition becomes very awkward. Perhaps it's not my place to suggest it, but maybe you should consider the "third person omnipotent." This will relieve you from tight quarters and open up the story, basically a "God's eye view." I have read and reviewed novels written by other RAT members, and I find the "first person" clumsy, especially when the story is placed in an era unfamiliar to present-day readers. If you wish, send me a PM and I can email a PDF of a historical novel written in the omnipotent style. ;-)
A combination of the two can sometimes work?
Also, I actually think the first person is a useful way to bring the period to life for the reader for whom it is otherwise alien? I certainly tend to think R Graves, M Yourcenar, and G Vidal took the right approach in part for this reason.
Sorry I was out getting things sorted out for uni (I'm Australian, so I finally start in March after doing my HSC over three years and a bridging course last year) so I didn't see the posts until I came back.
Quote: If you wish, send me a PM and I can email a PDF of a historical novel written in the omnipotent style.
Alan, thanks for the offer. I chose the first-person perspective because it helps me get into the head of one particular character. also, I'm willing to let you or someone else read it once it's done, if you want. If anyone is interested in reading it eventually, send me a PM.
On the object he's holding: Several descriptions of the statue describe him holding a bow and arrow, but I honestly can't see that. I can, though, see a bracer and shooting glove on his hand.
On the object he's holding: Several descriptions of the statue describe him holding a bow and arrow, but I honestly can't see that. I can, though, see a bracer and shooting glove on his hand.
Another question; Was the revolt in Sepphoris in 4 BCE a crisis?
Quote:Sorry I was out getting things sorted out for uni (I'm Australian, so I finally start in March after doing my HSC over three years and a bridging course last year) so I didn't see the posts until I came back.
Quote: If you wish, send me a PM and I can email a PDF of a historical novel written in the omnipotent style.
Alan, thanks for the offer. I chose the first-person perspective because it helps me get into the head of one particular character. also, I'm willing to let you or someone else read it once it's done, if you want. If anyone is interested in reading it eventually, send me a PM.
On the object he's holding: Several descriptions of the statue describe him holding a bow and arrow, but I honestly can't see that. I can, though, see a bracer and shooting glove on his hand.
Question: Was the revolt in Sepphoris in 4 BCE a crisis?
And also a note on the unlikelihood of Pantera being a slave. Obviously slaves were legally prohibited from enlisting the Roman army, but I've read a number of sources that suggest even though new recruits were interviewed about their legal status during the probatio, it was very difficult to prove that a recruit was definitely freeborn because people often didn't have records of their own births. Of course this doesn't make it more likely or likely at all that he wasn't freeborn.
And also a note on the unlikelihood of Pantera being a slave (which I brought up earlier in the thread). Obviously slaves were legally prohibited from enlisting in the Roman army, but I've read a number of sources that suggest that even though new recruits were interviewed about their legal status during the probatio, it was very difficult to prove that a recruit was definitely freeborn because people often didn't have records of their own births. Of course this doesn't make it more likely or likely at all that this was the case for him.
I originally didn't see the answers to this thread, so thanks everyone. Sorry, I was out getting things sorted out for uni (I'm Australian, so I finally start in March after doing my HSC over three years and a bridging course last year) so I didn't see the posts until I came back.
And
Quote: If you wish, send me a PM and I can email a PDF of a historical novel written in the omnipotent style.
Alan, thanks for the offer. I chose the first-person perspective because it helps me get into the head of one particular character.
On the object he's holding: Several descriptions of the statue describe him holding a bow and arrow, but I honestly can't see that. I can, though, see a bracer and shooting glove on his hand.
Quote:could a thirteen-year-old girl be a camp follower
Roman 'camp followers' were usually called calones or lixae. A calo was usually a slave, and a lixa usually a free person, sometimes directly employed by a military unit, sometimes just a private trader or worker, although both terms seem to have been used rather flexibly and perhaps changed over time.
I don't know of any direct evidence for teenage girls being employed as lixae or kept as calones. It's probably more likely that such a person would be with the army in some unofficial capacity, either as the daughter of a free servant or trader, the slave of an officer (most soldiers owned slaves, but only officers would keep the kind of extended households that might require young female slaves!) or as a prostitute, whether slave or free.
For more information on camp followers, Chapter 2 of Roth's The Logistics of the Roman Army at War: 264BC - AD235 has plenty of detail.
mile: 
If anyone is interested in reading it eventually, send me a PM.