\'Definitive\' List of Legionary\'s Belongings

[Flavivs Aetivs]

I gotta link to the new replik site in my guide, he makes some great stuff. I see the Cologne Spatha Chape, Dorchester Belt Parts, several Buckles, and several Spatha Sliders as well.

[jkaler48]

Jori> Tool List edited

[M. Demetrius]

3 or 4 would have a dolabra, 2 or 3 men would have baskets, a servant for the 8.

Somewhere I read that each soldier would typically carry two items from the list of tools, but that everybody carried a basket. So for example, a shovel and a mattock, a turf cutter and a dolabra, an axe and a shovel, etc. There's considerable argument on whether the sudes were also included in the list. But if each soldier carried a couple of those, and more sharp sticks were added for an overnight from woods cut for other reasons, the edges of the camp could be pretty sticky. Heh.

[Alanus]

How about LUNCH? illy:

After all, the Romans DID invent the sandwich. :cheer:

[Paul Elliott]

I didn't include rations, I have that filed away separately in my head at the moment (and I've collected a days rations too, and put up a thread about it a couple of months ago). Likewise tools, I think they would be allocated to the contubernium or century and they should be added to a separate list of GROUP KIT (something every re-enactment group would recognise!!!!)

I will add a GROUP KIT list.

[Frank]

Whats about "roman toilet paper" :?

A short wooden stick with a sponge at the end.

I am not sure, how the romans used it, but I myself would never share this tool with others.

[M. Demetrius]

Those would be found at the site of the latrine. And they DID use them in common. After use, they were rinsed in water and put in a jar of vinegar, ready for the next person. I can't imagine putting one in the pera or other gear bag.

[Paul Elliott]

Right I've ordered a razor from Holger Ratsdorff, as well as a new chateleine set, my current set is handmade from scrap brass!

[Frank]

And they DID use them in common. After use, they were rinsed in water and put in a jar of vinegar, ready for the next person. I can't imagine putting one in the pera or other gear bag.

I know, that there was fresh water in front of the guys sitting on the toilet. The vinegar was new to me. You sound pretty convinced. Are their really ancient sources, which confirm, that these sticks were shared? Also in the public toilets of roman cities? If yes, I don't wonder anymore, that so many ancient peoples had worms and worse diseases. We know ,that they had worms, from analyzing ancient shit.

I remember I have read, that roman nobles had a personal stick. Of course with one of the slaves accompanying those nobles all the time taking care of this stick. But thats long time ago and I did surely not check the footnote and primary source these times.

[M. Demetrius]

Well, here's one version of how it might have been done:

http://voices.yahoo.com/what-ancient-rom...tml?cat=60
and another
http://ancienthistory.about.com/od/hygie...t-Rome.htm
and yet another
http://purpleslinky.com/trivia/history/w...behaviour/

You be the judge, Frank. I'm pretty convinced. If it came to be the modern custom to use sponges again, I believe I'd have my own, carried in some kind of waterproof container. And the Roman History Enforcers would tell me that was farby. I wouldn't care much what they said. :-)

[Frank]

Thank you for these links. I did not know about the latin term atriensis detergeo, Well, it just means something like toilet attendant, but it is another hint, that probably they really shared that stick.

It's such a shame, that roman authors did not write about the real important things. :oops:

[Nathan Ross]

I did not know about the latin term atriensis detergeo

I suspect it was invented by whoever wrote the article! an atriensis or 'atrium attendant' was a house entrance keeper. I've never come across any reference to them working in toilets...

Are their really ancient sources, which confirm, that these sticks were shared?.

The only source that mentions the (in)famous sponge stick at all is Seneca, in his anecdote about the German prisoner of war killing himself by ramming one down his throat. The anecdote implies that these were common implements, but doesn't tell us anything more. Nor does it mean they were universally used.

Investigation of the sewers of Pompeii and Herculaneum has produced no sponges, or sticks. Instead it seems the people there used rags, leaves or even shards of pottery (!) to, erm, clean up with...

[Vindex]

MODERATOR GREEN!!

As interesting as these asides are, may I please ask that you remain on topic.

Perhaps personal ablutions would make an interesting topic of it's own?

End of Moderator Green!

[Paul Elliott]

Cheers Moi! It might be useful to compare the contents of soldier's packs from more recent history in order to compare them with ancient Rome. Perhaps the contents of a Napoleonic, Civil War or Boer War soldier might give us a hint of what the infantryman likes to lug around with him ....

[d.carmichael]

I am rather new to the site, and new to reenacting so I don't yet know nearly enough to contribute to this dicussion but on your last post about how it could be interesting to compare roman military equipment to other military equipment I might be able to help with. I am modern day Canadian Army and can easily give information on what a modern soldier will bring into the field with them. Of course this often does very by the soldiers working environment. A soldier whos combat arms such as infintry, artillery, or armoured would take lighter and more basic but essential equipment meanwhile an officer or a soldier who spends most if not their entire time in camp would bring more for comfort and luxuary.