Re: Ancient Veneti Warrios

[Domen]

http://www.eupedia.com/europe/ancient_eu..._dna.shtml

[diegis]

From what I read, Slavs was not a single block entity, but a mix on which, beside the what may be considered some proto-Slavic people was added Germanics, Iranic/Sarmatians, Baltic, Thraco-Dacians, even Romans (as from former Roman empire teritories) and probably Turkic too as this mix become the most visible under Avar kingdom centered in Panonia.

In all that mix of people the old Slavic language has become a sort of "lingua franca" and eventually led to formation of Slavs at the end of Antiquity/begining of Medieval Age, and their split in different "nations" with further different influences.
This explain too the various haplogroups existing at different Slavic people.

In areas most "emptied" at the end of Antiquity (due to fall of Roman empire, various inavsions, like Huns in Germany etc) this proto-Slavs has spread and occupied the holes, develpoing later in various Slavic nations.

I read the hypothesis as Slavs absorbed not just foreign people but lots of influences from them, like the god Perun from Baltics, the Sun god (forgot his name, I think to Baltics this is a Goddess actually) was taken or inspired by Sarmatians, or god Volos (Veles in other translation) inspired by Romanians (Daco-Romans), as the name Volos being inspired by the name "voloch" used to designed Romanians (German variant Walach).
Even one of his representation in mythology, as a sort of "dragon", corespond with the ancient symbol of Dacians, the "draco" standard. This had a snake body and a wolf head. Interesting, then name of wolf in Rusian is "volch" (volchitsa for shewolf) and the old name for Romanians was "voloch"-"volochitsa" (for Romanian woman), quite close
Volos was a god of forest and shepherds too, which again corespond with the way of life adopted at the begining of Medieval Age by Daco-Romans/Romanians

[Domen]

Such a quote which perfectly describes all disputes regarding the origins of Slavs:

"There is a jigsaw puzzle which consists of 1000 pieces. We have only 100 pieces, because the remaining 900 are missing. Basing on this we want to reconstruct the entirety. The probablity of making a mistake is huge. But it doesn't mean that we shouldn't try."

[Domen]

Demographic doubts concerning the supposed eastern origins of Slavs:

Sudden and permanent capture of huge areas of Central and Eastern Europe, creation of new social and economic structures there - this is a process, which was not accomplished by Goths, Vandals, Huns and Magyars. How could it be done by few farmers from Pripyat Swamps?

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The Slavs apparently lived far to the west already at first mention / first contact. According to Procopius of Caesarea, who noted this under year 512, Germanic Heruli, after being defeated by the Lombards (ca. 505 - 508), migrated from their homeland at the middle Danube river (A) to the land of the Warini at the Warnow river (B). During that migration, according to Procopius, the Heruli were travelling "in turn through all lands of the Sclaveni and vast wildernesses". This indicates, that already in the early 500s Slavs lived in vast areas between (A) and (B) - see the map below.

When it comes to Slavic incursions into the Byzantine Empire. According to Marcellinus Comes, already in 493 - 495 Thrace was invaded by some "unknown people". To describe them, he used the name of an already at that time non-existant tribe of the Gets (Getae). How do we know that those were Slavs? Over one hundred years later Theophylaktos Simokattes, historian of the early 7th century, explains that the Gets was a name given to Slavs at first contact (nearly all barbarian people attacking the Empire from the direction of the lower Danube river were being called like this - while the last mention of real Gets is from times of the reign of Vespasian in 1st century CE). Another Slavic invasion of Dobruja region is recorded in years 517 - 518, but here the invading people are already called the Antes. But those Slavic incursions from the direction of the Black Sea Coast were relatively small compared to those along the eastern foot of the Carpathian Mountains. The main Slavic pressure into the Danube line during the 6th century CE was by Slavic tribes migrating south between the Dniester River and the Carpathian Mountains, or even between the Pruth River and the Carpathian Mountains, so from the north-western direction, rather than from the north-eastern direction (see the map below):

http://s18.postimg.org/e3xzn71xl/Europa3.png



Finally - when it comes to © on the map posted above. This © is the place called Anthaib by author of "Historia Langobardorum" - Paul the Deacon. The region called "Anthaib" was - according to Paul the Deacon - one of regions passed by the Langobards during their migration south. The name of this place is sometimes connected with the Slavic Antes. As you can see, this place is located exactly in the middle between (A) and (B) - point of departure and destination of the Heruli migration in the early 6th century CE, during which - according to Procopius of Caesarea - the Heruli were marching through lands inhabited by the Sclaveni. Of course the Langobard migration took place earlier than the Heruli migration:

http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plik:Lombard_Migration.jpg



Maybe this is the region where the Lombards intermarried with the Slavs (Antes), which is indicated by anthropological studies.

[Domen]

Agriculturalists coming to Gelonos from the north for the purpose of trade may well have been Slavs, but they may also have been Finnic peoples. The proto-Slavs practised a shifting slash-and-burn agriculture and hence could only inhabit forested areas such as the west and north of modern Ukraine, or the whole of modern Belarus. They could not live on the steppe, but they could travel there for the purpose of trade with the nomadic inhabitants of that area.

Yes. But with slash-and-burn agriculture it was impossible to feed a population with density of more than 1 person per 1 km2. In area of Slavic Poland, slash-and-burn agriculture was replaced by crop rotation (dwupolówka, two-field rotation) already in the 7th century CE (the 600s).

BTW:

It is possible that the original carriers of Slavic language were Ancient Neuri and Budini:

I made a map, showing areas inhabited by Neuri and Budini (including Gelonos inside the territory of the Budini):

The boundary between mixed forest / forest-steppe (to the North) and steppe (to the South) is also marked:

My map: http://s18.postimg.org/83ag811x5/Budini_Neuri_2.png



Version with better visible archaeological cultures (Milograd, Chernoles, Zarubintsy, Kiev, Chernyakhovsk):

All these cultures are at least partially overlapping each other in geographic space:

http://postimg.org/image/ejmrid071/