Use of pilum with skirmishers

[FarDarter]

I just had the question; I am well aware the Roman heavy infantry used the pilum, but what of their skirmishers? It would make sense to do so; all troops using the same missile weaponry would simplify logistics. However, I cannot find anything to corroborate this.

[jkaler48]

There are tombstones with Legionaries holding javelins rather than Pila. I have speculated that these represent Legionary' in light armed cohorts who would often see employment as skirmishers.

[Flavivs Aetivs]

We know the Lancea and Veruta javelins remained in use.

[M. Demetrius]

Marines probably didn't use pila, but would have used javelins.

[Decebalus]

A pilum can be thrown for a rather short range only, so a javelin - especially when used with a sling - is more suitable for longer distances.
A skirmisher could bear a bundle of up to eight or ten of them in a javelin-case to battle. To bear more than two or three pila would be very impractical.

[Quintus Aurelius Lepidus]

is there proof that auxiliary infantry used javelins in javelin-cases? i thought javelins in cases were only used auxiliary cavalry.

if so, how many and of what type of javelin would infantry use? the 8 to 10 you say? i guess if so these are short verutum type javelins then. with shaft of 1 m, finger thick, ... ?

[Quintus Aurelius Lepidus]

or would it be more something like this:

These are javelin heads which armae is selling. they are 16 cm great. i'm wondering about the shaft though. I think total spear will be like 120 or 140 cm long or so.

But then I'm wondering whether you can actually put 8 or 10 of these in a quiver.

forgive me if you feel i'm going a little bit of topic.

[M. Demetrius]

I'm wondering whether you can actually put 8 or 10 of these in a quiver.

That would depend on the diameter of the quiver and how it was carried. It could not be suspended from a waist belt, of course, as they would be much too long.

[Mark Hygate]

Whilst having a 'single' missile weapon would indeed simplify logistics, do not forget that they have different uses.

The 'pilum' ('spiculum')is a heavy throwing weapon used to disrupt 'heavier' formations and thus the likely opposition for the legionary - it's short-range.

The 'lighter javelins' [Aside: I do not believe I've ever seen a definitive guide to the naming of all these shafted weapons] like the 'lancea' or 'verrutum' are more designed for 'skirmishing' (longer distance harassing fire) and to be carried in multiples (~3-5 perhaps for light infantry of the velite type, or lower for classic auxiliaries, with 20+ for cavalry (cf Arrian) in a quiver).

And then, of course, there is the 'hasta', or spear, which can be thrown in extremis, but is more used to hold off or use by cavalry, and for guard duties and is no real different to it's earlier Greek types.

Overall I feel it's much more likely that it's the Spears & Javelins that are the common types and that 'pila' are the legionary-only variety.

[Paul Elliott]

Indeed, Aurelius Mucianus in the Legio II Parthica is seen with a quiver on his tombstone from Apamea dated around 215 AD. I think the only one so depicted.

is there proof that auxiliary infantry used javelins in javelin-cases? i thought javelins in cases were only used auxiliary cavalry. .

[Michael Kerr]

Hi, still on the use of the pilum, I always wondered do Roman soldiers always throw pila in volleys or was there scope for an individual soldier to take out an enemy soldier by himself. I am assuming it is a volley weapon & an individual soldier risked incurring the wrath of his centurion by individual action but I was just curious.
Regards
Michael Kerr