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Regarding the change from the Mainz to the Pompeii style of gladius, Bishop and Coulston's Roman Military Equipment says "So was the change to the Pompeii type made in order to provide a sword equally well adapted to stabbing or chopping?" (p. 79) I thought it was the other way around, that the change to the Pompeii reflected a change to more of a thrusting style, and that the waisted blade of the Mainz would inflict more grievous slashing wounds.
Has anyone here conducted experiments as to the slashing efficacy of the Mainz vs. the Pompeii? I only have a Mainz gladius, so I can't make a comparison.
Jason
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quandoquidem natura animi mortalis habetur.
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Quote:Has anyone here conducted experiments as to the slashing efficacy of the Mainz vs. the Pompeii? I only have a Mainz gladius, so I can't make a comparison.
It's not only about having a sword with the right 'look' but also the construction should be right. IMHO doing such experiments with 'randomly chosen' blades doesn't make sence.
That being said the F.A.G.U.A. did some experiments with a reconstructed Roman gladius (after Sisak finds) and will extend these experiments soon. I would suggest you to contact Christian Koepfer about this.
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When you have a 2-3 pound sword, with a sharpened blade, I don't think you need to create differences between them, you can comfortably slash and stab. You don't even need sharpening for proper penetration.
Mark - Legio Leonum Valentiniani
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Quote:It's not only about having a sword with the right 'look' but also the construction should be right. IMHO doing such experiments with 'randomly chosen' blades doesn't make sence.
Agreed. I was just thinking that curved blades are generally better for slashing than straight blades, and although the curvature of the Mainz blade is very slight, it would, if anything, be slightly better for slashing than the Pompeii.
Also, if the Mainz blade was not designed that way, but became waisted from repeated sharpening, which the authors mention as a possibility, wouldn't that imply that it was used for slashing more than thrusting? I would think that if it was only used for thrusting that the tip would be in need of sharpening more often than the sides.
If the difference in the performance of the designs was negligible, did the Pompeii design perhaps become the standard later simply because it was easier to mass produce?
Jason
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Well, please keep also in mind that most 'Pompeii' type of swords aren't totally straight edged, anyway.
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As one who makes sharp swords and tests them too, I can assure you a straight edged blade is just as effective for slashing as one with a slight curvature. The only thing that could make a curved blade more effective is the cutting motion one can achieve when drawing the sword back from the cut, as then a curved blade would stay in contact longer and cut deeper. This however calls for a much sharper/deeper curve the those found on the Mainz, then you would be looking at something shaped like a falx.
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Quote:curved blades are generally better for slashing than straight blades,
Curved like a saber, or curved like a falx/sica?
Sabers are well-suited to slashing; a falx is better for hacking.
M. Demetrius Abicio
(David Wills)
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I was also thinking that because the Mainz design had more mass towards the tip it might be better at chopping, but since it's only slightly more mass there, perhaps that wouldn't make a difference either.
If the wasp-waisted blade had no cutting advantage, was that design just an aesthetic carry over then from the leaf shaped blades which were more popular in the bronze age? Could the reason why the gladius gradually became straighter with the Fulham, then the Pompeii be that since there was no appreciable advantage to the waisted blade it was just more work to make for nothing?
Jason
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A sabre (or a cutlass) has a curve of the sharp edge opposit to the falx, great for a cutting slash. The sharp end of the sabre curves away from the target, a falx curves inward. The Mainz has an inward curve.
I think Jason is right in his theory the Mainz follows the earlier bronze age shapes and then the shape is phased out for lack of any advantage.
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Thanks for the replies gentlemen. You've successfully dispelled another of my delusions, but I'm sure I still have many more to go. 
I just noticed I'm an immunis here now. No more ditch digging for me. Hurray!
Jason
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You might want to consider Republican-era swords too, then, such as Delos and Es Soumaa.
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Quote:I just noticed I'm an immunis here now. No more ditch digging for me. Hurray!
Nope. Now you're promoted to emptying the latrine pits! Progress, eh?  illy: 
M. Demetrius Abicio
(David Wills)
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http://www.mundohistoria.net/temas_foro/...punta-la-a
For those who read Spanish, here is an article on blade development in the early Republic. For those that don't, it has some interesting diagrams.
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