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Vegetarian gladiators...
#1
Dunno is someone already put that one on RCS. But anyway here it is and it comes as some sort of surprise to me...<br>
..And be indulgent. Remember this is a wire service story, not an archaeologists' report..<br>
F'rinstance, I think its "'retiarii" and not "retiariae".. And so on...<br>
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VIENNA, April 4 (AFP) - Hollywood has portrayed them as muscle-bound and handsome but Austrian anthropologists have found evidence suggesting that Roman gladiators were fat vegetarians who bore scant resemblance to Russell Crowe.<br>
The scientists did tests on skeletons of two different types of gladiators -- the myrmillos and retiariae -- found at the ancient site of Ephesus, near Selsuk in Turkey.<br>
"Tests performed on bits of bone taken from the skeletons of some 70 gladiators buried at Ephesus seem to prove that they ate mainly barley, beans and dried fruit," said Karl Grossschmidt, a forensic doctor who took part in the study by Austria's institute of archeology.<br>
"This diet, which has been mentioned in the oral history, is rather sad but it gave the gladiators a lot of strength even if it made them fat," said Grossschmidt who is a member of Vienna's institute of histology and embryology.<br>
The Austrian paleo-anthropologists relied on a method known as elementary micro-analysis that allows scientists to determine what a human being ate during his lifetime.<br>
With the help of a sonar, they could establish the chemical concentrations inside cells in the bone samples taken from the skeletons at Ephesus.<br>
From this, they could deduce how much meat, fish, grains and fruit made up the diet of the Roman fighting machines.<br>
A balanced diet of meat and vegetables leaves equal amounts of zinc and strontium in the cells, while a mainly vegetarian diet would leave high levels of strontium and little zinc, Grossschmidt said.<br>
"The bone density here was higher than usual, as is the case with modern athletes," said Fabian Kanz from the department of analytical chemistry at Vienna University.<br>
This line of testing allowed the scientists to debunk another myth -- that of the strappy Sparticus sandal sported in the arena.<br>
"The bone density is particularly high in samples taken from the feet, which would suggest that the gladiators fought with their bare feet in sand," Kanz said.(Ant.Luc. notes: this is confirmed by the mosaics)<br>
He believes that because some gladiators fought with little more than their bare hands, they could have "cultivated layers of fat to protect their vital organs from the cutting blows of their opponents."<br>
In ancient Rome, the classical battle of gladiators usually pitted a myrmillo armed with a sword, a helmet and a round shield, against the lightly armed retiarius who carried only a net and a dagger (Ant.Luc. notes: you forgot the trident, dummy..), or a samnite who wore a visor and a leather sheath protecting his right arm. (Ant.Luc. notes:...Oh forget it, I give up...)<br>
They were mostly slaves who volunteered to fight because sometimes the victor would be freed as a reward, or poor Romans who fought for pay.(Ant.Luc notesSmile<br>
The Austrian scientists are still carrying out further tests, but if their initial findings are confirmed it would change the glamorous image of the men immortalised in movies like Spartacus, starring a young Kirk Douglas, and the more recent Gladiator with Crowe in the main role.<br>
"It seems that the gladiators tried to put on some weight before their battles," Kanz said.<br>
"But this does not mean that they did not work hard to lose it again once they stepped out of the ring," he added with a smile.<br>
The archeological site of Ephesus is one of the most important in Turkey.<br>
The city was founded by the Greeks but it was the Romans who made it the capital of their Asian province and turned it into one of the wealthiest cities of their empire.<br>
Austrian anthropologists have been working on the site since 1898.<br>
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#2
Its amazing what you can find if you look for it.<br>
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(a) they were called the barley men ??<br>
(b) the pictoral evedence shows no sandals??<br>
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My questions would be did the rest of Slavedom eat steak for dinner and just how fat would a slave get ( un-gelded of course ) on this diet if he was working his gelds off ?<br>
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The illustrations & statuettes dont show tubby gladiators & would you appredciate the sight of overweight, slow ( but strong) slogging matches lasting.. ooooh ...seconds ? And how big would the shields need to be ??<br>
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Maybe they aren't bandageds on the Thracians legs ...its rolls of fat !!<br>
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Seriously ... does anyone out there know how a barley diet would affect weight ?<br>
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Conal<br>
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#3
Yes, no sandals. Most of the time. What you see are foot protections, not shoes.<br>
And actually, overweight doesn't mean necessarily sumo style. I know a few heavyweight boxers that are a bit overweight too. The evidence shows pretty massive individuals, usually.<br>
Dunno about the veggie diet, but those guys seem to know what they're talking about. But honestly I'm surprised too.<br>
Never heard of a vegetarian diet that makes people fatter, personally..<br>
The beans maybe?<br>
Or the barley? After all beer is made with barley.<br>
Maybe they only had beer bellies? <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub45.ezboard.com/bromanarmytalk.showUserPublicProfile?gid=antoninuslucretius@romanarmytalk>Antoninus Lucretius</A> <IMG HEIGHT=10 WIDTH=10 SRC="http://lucretius.homestead.com/files/Cesar_triste.jpg" BORDER=0> at: 4/5/04 5:24 pm<br></i>
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#4
my view is they set out to prove a known point ... therfore sussing out no sandals & a barley diet was bound to be the result of the research. research has a tendancy to focus .. and that can lead to blinkering out other posibilities ...i.e. once to feel you have proved the point ... do you <strong>PROVE</strong> it to destruction ?<br>
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Would standing on sand densen the bones more than standing in the streets of Pompeii with sandals on ?<br>
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Maybe it was a slave lifestyle carrying & fetching or the weight of armour, shield etc rather than the bearfootedness? <p></p><i></i>
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#5
Quote:</em></strong><hr>my view is they set out to prove a known point <hr><br>
You are right. In 1967, Michael Grant wrote:<br>
"Gladiators were called <em>hordearii</em>, barley men, because of the amount of barley that they ate, a muscle-building food but criticized by Galen for making the flesh soft" (p.44). <p></p><i></i>
** Vincula/Lucy **
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#6
Hello all<br>
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I think what the dietary finds show here is how the gladiators in Ephesus ate at the time in question and not much else.<br>
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An interestuing quote from Sander was given on the RCS about the dietary habits of some other gladiators:<br>
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Reference to the fattening up of gladiators:<br>
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Cyprianus, 2.2<br>
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Paratur gladiatorius ludus, ut libidinem crudelium luminum sanguis oblectet; impletur in succum cibis fortioribus corpus: et arvina assidui nidoris membrorum moles robusta pinguescit, ut saginatus in paenam carius pereat: homo occiditur in hominis voluptatem, et ut quis possit occidere peritia est, usus est, ars est<br>
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'The gladiatorial school is intended so that blood can satisfy the lust of cruel eyes; the body is filled with the most nourishing food to fatness: and the robust mass of limbs is fattened up amidst the neverending greasy kitchen smells, so that covered in lard he may die harder as a punishment: a man is killed to the satisfaction of man, and even in such a manner that what can kill, is a skill, is a custom, is an art: '<br>
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I suspect that fat doesn't mean grossly over weight to the inability of movement but with a good layer of fat over the body, as for images if you take a good look at a lot of the images that do not make it into the mainstream books there are a good prtion of smooth looking big gladiators. But to be honest given different genetic abilities to store or loose weight I suspect that there would hae been thin and fat out there.<br>
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As to the diet of pulse foods, I know that modern body builders will often avoid pulse food prior to shows as it retains water and builds a fatty/doughy/watery layer around the body.<br>
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Hope this helps. <p></p><i></i>
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#7
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If, while training, you eat a great amount of beans and rice (or barley) you can built good muscles anyway without eating meat or fish proteins, but you could become a fat "jet" man and kill (or stun..) your rival by mean of the chemical war But fat vs. slim gladiators could be a show in the show.<br>
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What diet for Sumo wrestlers?<br>
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Valete,<br>
Titus<br>
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<p></p><i></i>
TITVS/Daniele Sabatini

... Tu modo nascenti puero, quo ferrea primum
desinet ac toto surget Gens Aurea mundo,
casta faue Lucina; tuus iam regnat Apollo ...


Vergilius, Bucolicae, ecloga IV, 4-10
[Image: PRIMANI_ban2.gif]
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#8
Gee, and I thought Gladiators ate their wounded.... just goes to show ya!<br>
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Hibernicus <p></p><i></i>
Hibernicus

LEGIO IX HISPANA, USA

You cannot dig ditches in a toga!

[url:194jujcw]http://www.legio-ix-hispana.org[/url]
A nationwide club with chapters across N America
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#9
story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=573&ncid=757&e=1&u=/nm/20040414/od_nm/life_australia_escape_dc<br>
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See, both chubby AND barefoot... <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub45.ezboard.com/bromanarmytalk.showUserPublicProfile?gid=antoninuslucretius@romanarmytalk>Antoninus Lucretius</A> <IMG HEIGHT=10 WIDTH=10 SRC="http://lucretius.homestead.com/files/Cesar_triste.jpg" BORDER=0> at: 4/15/04 12:51 am<br></i>
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