How to dye veg tanned leather red?

[Agraes]

For an upcoming project I plan to make a globa, the light skin cover of a thoracomachus which according to the 6th century De Magistratibus, was also worn sometimes as a garnment of its own.
The Romans beeing fond of the color of Mars, even in the late empire, I would like to dye it a nice red or at least reddish color, preferably more 'oxblood' thant scarlet.
Leather dyes can be found easily but if I can use something natural and available in the past it would be better.

I read that the Romans used madder to dye leather aswell as on textiles. I read also about birch and oak barks as used in the past.
I know how to dye or at least color veg tanned leather different shades of brown, and black (with steel and vinegar), but I have no clue how to naturally dye it red. Any idea?

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

I find if I use red leather dye, it turns red..naturally! :mrgreen:

But seriously, a good question.....I thought it was covered in a thread some years back, but
possibly tha twas the dyed wool/linen discussions.

[Tarbicus]

Some useful links and discussion at the Bushcraft forum advising a traditional bookbinder.

[koechlyruestow]

Agraes,

Are you sure the globais not the Latin translation of noberonikion? I am not sure, but I thought it was, but I cannot find where I put the reference.
The noberonikion was a surcoat, to be worn over the armour to protect it against the elements and to hide the reflection of its metal when scouting or laying an ambush. It was usually made of felt or linen cloth, but the noberonikion in the Strategikon of Emperor Maurice is made of fur, so: animal skin, not leather. That is not an exclusively Roman fashion, the famous Persian example is the babr bayan, the leopard or tiger skin surcoat worn by kings and epic heroes. It was an ample, wide coat closed on the chest, reaching over the knees and with short sleeves.

[jvrjenivs]

I know Christian Koepfer did some experiments with painting leather (for cinguli) with casein based paints and afterwards covered them with a layer of wax/oil mixture to protect the paint from getting rubbed off. I'm not sure about the results anymore, but if I remember right, it wasn't a very good solution as the paint were taken of by the friction the belt got when used on armour.

[Agraes]

Thanks everyone.

To answer Eduard, it's a different garnment. In the De Rebus Bellicis there is a lenghty discussion of the thoracomachus and mention of a tailored cover of "lybian skin" for it to make it waterproof.

Jean Lydus describes the globa as a leather garnment with poedeones - the obiquitous pteryges we see so much depicted on roman soldiers. The globa is also described as great antiquity in the 6th century, only used by the palace guards. It's something completly different from a surcoat.

See this discussion on the french late roman forum:
http://schnucks0.free.fr/forum/viewtopic...racomachus

[Targitios]

Dye it with madder as you would do it with wool. It works well an becomes a deep red colour. You only have to be aware that the water must not boil and the leather should not contact the kettle or it would get stained at these parts.

[gaiusseptimiuslucianus]

Dye it with madder as you would do it with wool. It works well an becomes a deep red colour. You only have to be aware that the water must not boil and the leather should not contact the kettle or it would get stained at these parts.

Stephen,

Do you need to use a mordant?

Thanks,

Lucianus

[Targitios]

Yes. Just like you need to do it with wool.