Dating the francisca

[Virilis]

Salvete Omnes!

What is the earlier context of a francisca found? I found in the book "Gallien in der Spätantike" a grave of a man (Marteville) which had a francisca from the second half of the 4th c. AD. I have always thought that franciscas are only found from much later context. Does this mean that I can add a francisca to my impression too?

[Flavivs Aetivs]

Well it wasn't called a Fransisca until the 6th century (At least not according to Halsall, I think prior to that it was called a Serricis or something), but yes you can: they are depicted in the Notitia Dignitatum and several are in the 3rd and 4th century Bog finds I think.

[Nathan Ross]

There's an interesting essay by Walter Pohl here that suggests that these axes were not commonly called by the name 'francisca' (securis was apparently the more common term), or at least not when the Franks were using them! He also mentions that it was thought to be originally a Roman weapon... so perhaps it just might be found in a Roman military context before appearing in Frankish graves?

[Flavivs Aetivs]

Securis, that's what I was trying to say. Thanks Nathan.

[Thomas V.]

Salvete Omnes!

What is the earlier context of a francisca found? I found in the book "Gallien in der Spätantike" a grave of a man (Marteville) which had a francisca from the second half of the 4th c. AD. I have always thought that franciscas are only found from much later context. Does this mean that I can add a francisca to my impression too?

Do you mean the axe found in the Marteville grave number 13? If so, the axe wouldn't be a francisca according to Böhme's classification. It would belong to the type C (because of the slightly curved upper edge) of the axes with "Schaftlochlappen" (because of the "Schaftlochlappen", obviously ;-)) instead. Nonetheless: Böhme states that the slightly curved upper edges of the C-type "Schaftlochlappen" axes already are reminiscent of the francisca shape.

[Virilis]

Thanks Thomas, this is what I meant.

[AlexV]

Hi there,

The term "francisca" is certainly unpropper, but I keep it because it's certainly, for now, the best describing word in regards of the terms "bipenis" and "securis", and shorter than "throwing-frankish-axe"

According to the european archeologists (from France and Germany), this weapon, the "true francisca" for Périn, Legoux, Hübener, Dahmlos..) seems to appear arround 480 (or maybe few earlier, arround 460/70), to the half of the VIth century (and "late VIth" period for the "common francisca"). (see attached: at to the "true", with double curve on it's back, and second the "common", with a single curve).

Another model of throwing axe, also called "pré-francisque" or "francisque proto-mérovingienne", as "late roman francisca" is know, withou any timeframe raccord to the 2 models above.

This typ of axe is, according to Hübener, Ament, Böhme and Périn, dated from 400 to 440, with an possible enlargment as 370/460.
In comparaison of the true and common models, there is a verry little amount of models found in archeological contexts.
This is maybe a corrollary to the furniture-graves culture that began near 470?

However, if we just focus on the true and the common franciscas, there is a problem with S.Apollinaris: he said that the franks were used to fight with throwing axes since their childhood. In 470, that's to say this sort of battle-style was, if not prevalent, at least common for some frankish tribes since 40 years i think.
So, my personnal mind is that the franciscas, as throwing axes, could be certainly integrated to the second thirds of the Vth, and the problem is now to know which model was used.. and , in each category, with one was a real throwing axe, and wich one not (or a missed work by the builder ). That's the other question of the angles between the handle and the top-edge of the sharp..


edit: a short bibliography:

Salin, Edouard:1957: « La civilisation Mérovingienne d'après les sépultures, les textes et le laboratoire,troisième partiel Les Techniques»;

Martin, Max: 1993: «Observation sur l’armement de l’époque mérovingienne précoce.», in «L'armée romaineet les Barbares du IIIè au VIIè siècle .» («Association Française d'archéologie Mérovingienne et dumusée des Antiquités Nationales )

Hübener, Wolfgang:1980: « Eine Studie zu den Beilwaffen der Merowingerzeit », (Zeitschrift für Archäologie desMittelalters, 1980-8)

Dahmlos, Ulrich:1977: « Francisca – bipenis – securis: Bemerkung zu archâologishem Befund und schriftlicher
Überlieferung»(Germania anzeiger der Römusch-Germanischen komission des DeutschenArchäologischen instituts)

von Carnap-Bornheim, Claus :1994: « Beilträge zu Römischer und barbarischer Bewaffung in den ersten vier nachchrisltlichen Jahrhunderten » (Akten des 2. Internationalen Kolloquiums in Marburg a. d. Lahn, 20 bis 24.Februar 1994);

Böhme, Horst-Wolfgang:1974: «Germanische Grabfunde des 4. bis 5. Jahrhunderts zwischen unterer Elbe und Loire>>,Studien zur Chronologie und Bevölkerungsgeschichte

Ament, Hermann:2006: « Die archäologischen Funde des frühen Mittelalters aus dem westlichen Deutschland im Museum für Vor- und Frühgeschichte Berlin» , Bestandskataloge Band 10

Association Française d'Archéologie Mérovingienne (et Société des Amis du Musée des AntiquitésNationales):
« La noblesse romaine et les chefs barbares» (textes réunis par F.Vallet et M.Kazanski);
«Chronologie normalisée du mobilier funéraire mérovingien entre Manche et Loraine»,Legoux R., Périn P. et Vallet F. ;

[Thomas V.]

However, if we just focus on the true and the common franciscas, there is a problem with S.Apollinaris: he said that the franks were used to fight with throwing axes since their childhood. In 470, that's to say this sort of battle-style was, if not prevalent, at least common for some frankish tribes since 40 years i think.

Throwing axe doesn't necessarily mean francisca. It's possible that the adult warriors, that were the first users of the francisca, trained with other throwing axe types / francisca antecessors during their childhood

So, my personnal mind is that the franciscas, as throwing axes, could be certainly integrated to the second thirds of the Vth, and the problem is now to know which model was used [..].

Your view isn't far-fetched. According to Böhme, the axe head found in the Haillot grave 11 is already a real francisca; the broken axe head found in the grave Spontin B might be a francisca. Using Böhme's newer chronology, both axe heads can be dated to the second third of the fifth century (B/C of the fixed-plate buckle from Haillot and the conical glass beaker with pedestal and thread application from Spontin). According to the classification shown in the picture you posted, the axe from Haillot is a "true francisca". If the axe head from Spontin really should have been a francisca, it would also belong to the "true type".


EDIT

Böhme lists three paralles to the (two) francisca finding(s) mentioned above: Wageningen grave 156 and St. Severin (Cologne) graves 64 and 65. The first grave contained a buckle of the Krefeld-Gellep type, wich means that the grave can be dated to the second third of the fifth century. The two latter graves are dated to the middle of the fifth century by Böhme.

[Y]es you can: they are depicted in the Notitia Dignitatum and several are in the 3rd and 4th century Bog finds I think.

Are there really francisca depictions in the ND and were there really franciscas among the bogfinds of the third and fourth centuries?

[Flavivs Aetivs]

However, if we just focus on the true and the common franciscas, there is a problem with S.Apollinaris: he said that the franks were used to fight with throwing axes since their childhood. In 470, that's to say this sort of battle-style was, if not prevalent, at least common for some frankish tribes since 40 years i think.

It's possible Sidonius may have seen first hand combat with the Franks considering he provides a detailed description of the Battle of Vicus Helenae in Majorian's Pangeyric. We know he helped fund a private war to keep Augustonemetum in Roman hands against the Visigoths.

I would not be surprised if he knew a good deal about Frankish combat and Customs, even indirectly.

[AlexV]

Your view isn't far-fetched. According to Böhme, the axe head found in the Haillot grave 11 is already a real francisca; the broken axe head found in the grave Spontin B might be a francisca. Using Böhme's newer chronology, both axe heads can be dated to the second third of the fifth century (B/C of the fixed-plate buckle from Haillot and the conical glass beaker with pedestal and thread application from Spontin). According to the classification shown in the picture you posted, the axe from Haillot is a "true francisca". If the axe head from spontin really should have been a francisca, it would also belong to the "true type".

Thanks for your explainaitions!
Unfortunatly, i haven't seen the last Böhme's chronology; did you have any tittle of this papper please?

[Thomas V.]

Thanks for your explainaitions!
Unfortunatly, i haven't seen the last Böhme's chronology; did you have any tittle of this papper please?

Böhme, H.W., 1987, Gallien in der Spätantike. Forschungen zum Ende der Römerherrschaft in den westlichen Provinzen. Jahrbuch des Römisch-Germanischen Zentralmuseums Mainz 34, 770-773.

[AlexV]

Ha! Si i have it! I though he had done another update of it's works

[arminius]

Can anybody post pictures of the Marteville, Haillot and Spontin axes, plz ?

[jho]

Haillot – published in J. Breuer - H. Roosens, Le Cimetière Franc de Haillot. Archaeologica Belgica 34 (1957), available online here:

http://webapps.fundp.ac.be/bib/pdf/424.pdf


Spontin – published in A. Limelette, Cimetière franc de Spontin. Ann. Soc. Arch. de Namur 8, 1863-64, 354, available online here:

googlebooks

Marteville I believe is commonly referred to as Marteville à Vermand. This was published in Eck, Les deux cimetières gallo-romains de Vermand et de Saint-Quentin (1891) and Boulanger, Le Mobilier Funéraire Gallo-Romain et Franc en Picardie et en Artois (1905). I could not find those online but you can find pics in these lavishly illustrated publications of the Met Museum:

From Attila to Charlemagne

http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/works-of-a...2.143-.146

(links to publications at the lower right of the page)

[Flavivs Aetivs]

Haillot – published in J. Breuer - H. Roosens, Le Cimetière Franc de Haillot. Archaeologica Belgica 34 (1957), available online here:

http://webapps.fundp.ac.be/bib/pdf/424.pdf


Spontin – published in A. Limelette, Cimetière franc de Spontin. Ann. Soc. Arch. de Namur 8, 1863-64, 354, available online here:

googlebooks

Marteville I believe is commonly referred to as Marteville à Vermand. This was published in Eck, Les deux cimetières gallo-romains de Vermand et de Saint-Quentin (1891) and Boulanger, Le Mobilier Funéraire Gallo-Romain et Franc en Picardie et en Artois (1905). I could not find those online but you can find pics in these lavishly illustrated publications of the Met Museum:

From Attila to Charlemagne

http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/works-of-a...2.143-.146

(links to publications at the lower right of the page)

I'll be taking these... :whistle: