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Ancients behaving badly: Julius Caesar
#16
I for one am glad that the history of Socrates, the epitome of that of Philostorgius, and the history of Zosimus survive. It's better to have partisan history than no history. I don't think partisan history has to be less valuable than 'objective' history either. A writer's passion for their truth may motivate research into the truth, and a writer whose aims are obvious tells more about their world view, and how it differed from other world views in that time and place, than a writer whose aims are less-than-obvious.

I don't know what the show was like. I tend to distrust the 'Great Man' approach to history, and it encourages some to build up an image of someone who was better, or someone who was worse, or someone who was larger-than-life both ways.
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#17
Quote:Stefan,
....what are you trying to say by this??

What Macedon delved into, namely that we are "seeing things through our own biased spectacles". Every age has its own bias. In the 19th century, ancient events and leaders were boldly interpreted through nationalistic lenses (Hermann, the leader of the "Germans"). In the 20th century we saw "class struggle" between optimates and populares creeping into Roman history. Now multiculturalism and its moral double standards of judging the history of the West and the rest is permeating scholarship.
Stefan (Literary references to the discussed topics are always appreciated.)
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#18
Quote:Why, why is the Roman Empire always depicted as the 'nazis' of the Ancient world???? :?
Well, how about this, for a non-political answer: Since time immemorial, people have liked to shoehorn reality into a simple, dramatic narrative with heroes and villains. Since we don't laud imperialism anymore and romanticising the Romans is passe, they get to be villains for a bit, and since the history and society of the Celtic and Germanic tribes isn't as well-documented, it's easy to cast them in the noble savage trope. My only question is how do you get people to stop pretending that sort of storybook portrayal is an accurate depiction of reality?
Dan D'Silva

Far beyond the rising sun
I ride the winds of fate
Prepared to go where my heart belongs,
Back to the past again.

--  Gamma Ray

Well, I'm tough, rough, ready and I'm able
To pick myself up from under this table...

--  Thin Lizzy

Join the Horde! - http://xerxesmillion.blogspot.com/
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#19
Quote:I saw the one on Attila the Hun, it made the Roman army look like pathetic weaklings.

Ferrill seemed to think they were, and quoted Attila as considering the Roman units "beneath contempt." Elton disagreed.
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#20
Stefan,
.... thanks for clarifying this.

All others,
....we have already begun to discuss things about Caesar and Genocide as a "sideview" here : ....
http://www.romanarmytalk.com/rat/25-alli...-size.html
I think you may find some of the postings quite interesting as they are touching that very subject.
And as to "History on TV" --- some say "That's Entertainment" and I may add: even worse than
the infamous "Hollywood Romans". ;-)
I've given up on "getting nervous" when watching such , ahmmmm, "ejaculations" on TV thanks
to German's ZDF-TV, which made me get used to such rubbish. The "third programmes" , however, offer better quality (for most parts of their respective broadcasts)especially when one is considering the lesser funding they enjoy. But in all I've begun to see such things "in the mild light of the evening sun" , so to speak. (Rest asured there are enough things left that I do NOT see that way ;-) )

For now

Greez & Thanks

Simplex
Siggi K.
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#21
Quote:Stefan,
.... thanks for clarifying this.

All others,
....we have already begun to discuss things about Caesar and Genocide as a "sideview" here : ....
http://www.romanarmytalk.com/rat/25-alli...-size.html
I think you may find some of the postings quite interesting as they are touching that very subject.
And as to "History on TV" --- some say "That's Entertainment" and I may add: even worse than
the infamous "Hollywood Romans". ;-)
I've given up on "getting nervous" when watching such , ahmmmm, "ejaculations" on TV thanks
to German's ZDF-TV, which made me get used to such rubbish. The "third programmes" , however, offer better quality (for most parts of their respective broadcasts)especially when one is considering the lesser funding they enjoy. But in all I've begun to see such things "in the mild light of the evening sun" , so to speak. (Rest asured there are enough things left that I do NOT see that way ;-) )

For now

Greez & Thanks

Simplex

Makes sense. :-) Rubbish is a apt description of this episode. I am glad to see I am not alone in my assessment of the History channel. ;-)
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#22
I'm interested to see if there will ever be a reformation in the History Channel. True, they were horrible with anything before 1700, and for a while, they would show nothing other than WWII documentaries. But, despite its old flaws, the History Channel is one of the things that inspired me to enter the history profession. I truly believe that reality shows are a fad, and will one day be nothing more than a bad memory. I did see that Julius Caesar episode (i also believe that the did one on Caligula) and to be frank, it was horrible. However, it is our job as reenactors, teachers, and historians to control the damage and direct the ignorant towards the light of historic accuracy. Who knows, maybe one day someone will make a sensational, historically accurate Roman epic. Until then, however, we need to press on, make our presentations as accurate as possible, and yes mike, not use setonius as a historic reference. I just wanted to get my two cents in. 8-)

Regards,
Tyler
Tyler

Undergrad student majoring in Social Studies Education with a specialty in world history.

"conare levissimus videri, hostes enimfortasse instrumentis indigeant"
(Try to look unimportant-the enemy might be low on ammunition).
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#23
I would like it if they would stop showing modern reality shows.....what does tha thave to do with History.....
Visne partem mei capere? Comminus agamus! * Me semper rogo, Quid faceret Iulius Caesar? * Confidence is a good thing! Overconfidence is too much of a good thing.
[b]Legio XIIII GMV. (Q. Magivs)RMRS Remember Atuatuca! Vengence will be ours!
Titus Flavius Germanus
Batavian Coh I
Byron Angel
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#24
Quote:...yes mike, not use setonius as a historic reference.

You think he is that unreliable? I'd say we are dependent on him, whether we like it or not. Without Suetonius and Plutarch, our two main surviving biographers, we would know only half about many ancient personalities and emperors.
Stefan (Literary references to the discussed topics are always appreciated.)
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#25
Quote:
Titus Manlius Verus post=322630 Wrote:...yes mike, not use setonius as a historic reference.

You think he is that unreliable? I'd say we are dependent on him, whether we like it or not. Without Suetonius and Plutarch, our two main surviving biographers, we would know only half about many ancient personalities and emperors.

He is the 'tabloid' of the ancient world! :grin: Plutach not much better.
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#26
I read him in its entirety ten years ago, and I remember his style being a curious mixture of writing dull about frivolous things. He was also evidently one of a superstitious kind, describing each emperor's death accompanied by a number of omen. But as a high official he must have had access to archives about which we know next to nothing, so I would not discount the imperial decadence he described lightly as fictitious.
Stefan (Literary references to the discussed topics are always appreciated.)
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#27
Quote:
mike esposito post=322478 Wrote:It is a shame that people will watch and believe that Caesar was really a despot.


Ah, yeah. I am sure noone in antiquity would have ever even dared to imagine that :lol:

[Image: Brutus_Eid_Mar.jpg]

Sic semper tyrannis!

Yes, well, there is the weak minded to contend with... :evil:
Visne partem mei capere? Comminus agamus! * Me semper rogo, Quid faceret Iulius Caesar? * Confidence is a good thing! Overconfidence is too much of a good thing.
[b]Legio XIIII GMV. (Q. Magivs)RMRS Remember Atuatuca! Vengence will be ours!
Titus Flavius Germanus
Batavian Coh I
Byron Angel
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#28
Quote:He is the 'tabloid' of the ancient world! :grin: Plutach not much better.
What about Cicero? Confusedilly:

[Image: cicero1.jpg]


Quote:Yes, well, there is the weak minded to contend with... :evil:
How about Cicero? :whistle:

~Theo
Jaime
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