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Achilles and Hector
#1
Ave,<br>
<br>
What is historical evidence proving or disproving the existance and reputation of these two men? Alexander was reputed to have visited the tomb of Achilles, but was this "tomb" more of a monument?<br>
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I understand that Agamemnon and the Trojan war are confirmed historical icons, but what of these two men in particular?<br>
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-Spatha <p></p><i></i>
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#2
Well, there actually isn't evidence that Agamemnon existed (unless you're aware of something I'm not; the so-called "Mask of Agamemnon" is too early by a few hundred years). It is true that there was a city which fits the general location and description of Troy, and was destroyed by fire at approximately the right time for the Trojan War. Later Greeks (and Romans) thought that it was around there. So it's probably a good bet that there was a Troy.<br>
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As for the tomb of Achilles, the monument itself surely existed; the ancients may have believed it to be real. You might compare (I don't mean to provoke any sort of religious debate here...) the veneration of holy relics of saints during the Middle Ages in Europe (and continuing up to the present). Some believe, some don't. And whether or not a particular item is actually what it claims to be, is I believe beyond the capability of science at this point.<br>
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Thus far, the only 'evidence' for the existence of Achilles and Hector is Homer (and other ancient authors drawing on the pre-Homeric tradition of the Trojan war). <p></p><i></i>
Dan Diffendale
Ph.D. candidate, University of Michigan
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#3
8)
  
Remarks by Philip on the Athenian Leaders:
Philip said that the Athenians were like the bust of Hermes: all mouth and dick. 
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#4
(The original post already took Troy to be historical, so I didn't mention these then...) Hittite texts do mention a city called Wilusa/Wilusiya with a king named Alaksandus, which most people accept to be Troy and an Alexander/Paris (not necessarily the one of legend). The Hittite texts, as you say, are not mythological but historical.

Calvert Watkins has a very interesting discussion of these matters on pp. 144-151 of his book How to Kill a Dragon. He mentions as well the god of Wilusa, Appaliunas, equated with Apollo. But so far nothing on Achilles or Hector or the rest...
Dan Diffendale
Ph.D. candidate, University of Michigan
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#5
Here's a link to an article in .pdf format that gives a thorough account of the Hittite source material:

[url:3d1scqs6]http://www.uni-tuebingen.de/troia/eng/lataczwilusaeng.pdf[/url]
Dan Diffendale
Ph.D. candidate, University of Michigan
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#6
8)
  
Remarks by Philip on the Athenian Leaders:
Philip said that the Athenians were like the bust of Hermes: all mouth and dick. 
Reply
#7
Yep, Gyges shows up in Assyrian histories as well. Cuneiform records sure are fun, aren't they? Smile

And, I'd say the evidence definitely points to there being more than a kernel of truth in the "myth" of the Trojan War. Glad to hear the spirit of antiquity is rising in you again!
Dan Diffendale
Ph.D. candidate, University of Michigan
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