Double Belt/Crossed Belt Gladius Mountings

[Magnus]

Wait, he had his 2nd belt in a sack with his sword? And how wide were the plates? Perhaps this was a transitional style between the crossed belts and single wider belt of the later imperial period.

[PhilusEstilius]

[attachment=3919]00001113Small.jpg[/attachment]
Here are some of the button/loop fasteners in my collection the larger one at the bottom of the picture has a base line of the triangle that is 26mm ie 1 inch.
Therefore to get that through a piece of leather would need at least a cut in the leather of 1 inch or the 26mm, then to have any thongs or straps connected to the triangle at the back of the belt it would have to be turned through 90%

This would present a problem for where the triangular frame joins the disc it is 12mm wide and this is in the region of 1/2 inch, therefore the cut in the leather is going to be forced wide apart spreading the cut where we begin to put strain at the ends of it.

There is also that these larger loop fasteners have a gap between the disc and the triangular plate of around 10mm, therefore the discs are going to be pushed outwards away from the belt so that when you begin to hang a sword of 2 to 3 Kg on to these loop fasteners there is a god chance that the guttering of a scabbard could snap the stud discs.
Where you are so sure with all these assumptions you are putting forward that button/loop fasteners were used just which of the four rings of the scabbard hold the straps and give your ideas of how such straps become fixed to the triangular frames of the button/loop fasteners.
This is of course where the two cuts in the leather are pushed wide open and under strain each side of the scabbard.
I do not realy think that button/loop fasteners are used at all for sword suspension, in fact the figure showing that sword is simply two straps crossed behind a belt without and the four studs on the belt are all just studs with maybe bellcaps at the back.
The two studs we see at each side of the scabbard guttering do of course prevent any side ways movement of the sword amen.

[caiusbeerquitius]

Here are some of the button/loop fasteners in my collection the larger one at the bottom of the picture has a base line of the triangle that is 26mm ie 1 inch.
Therefore to get that through a piece of leather would need at least a cut in the leather of 1 inch or the 26mm, then to have any thongs or straps connected to the triangle at the back of the belt it would have to be turned through 90%

But these could be pushed through the belt from the back as well, no?

[PhilusEstilius]

Christian.

That could be done I suppose however those two large loop fasteners I have shown have discs that are 35mm diameter, and if one did want to fit one onto a belt it would be better to put the diagonal stitching loop through from the front as the triangle base is less than the disc size at 26mm.

[caiusbeerquitius]

Brian,
whatever would be smaller, if so, I guess.

[Vindex]

Brian,

I know you have access to Mike Bishop's article on 'the Early Imperial Apron' already, but for any others reading this it can be found here:
http://www.jrmes.org.uk/vol03.htm


Crispvs

Slightly off topic but I don't suppose anyone has a pdf of that Hyland article mentioned in the JRMES reference?