Equites Stablesiani

[D B Campbell]

According to Hoffmann it's a hybrid (stablesianoi): from Latin stabulum it might have been rendered to Greek stablos, with the suffix -ianus. (Hoffmann p.251).

Hoffmann may be onto something, but perhaps hasn't explained it clearly.

stablizô is the (late) Greek verb for "stabling a horse", hence the stablisianos is the "groom" responsible for that action. (See Sophocles' handy Lexicon, p. 1005.) It's a small step from stablisianoi to stablêsianoi (Greek) and Stablesiani (Latin).

I still like Dessau's comment (ad ILS 2793), that nominis origo adhuc latet ("So far, the origin of the word lies hidden"). :wink:

Hoffmann also mentioned a Tribunus or Comes stabuli...

Already mentioned previously (with Amm. Marc. ref.)

[Vindex]

So my stabilization cavalry has crashed and burned then? Chunter, chunter, chunter...

It's the end of the world as I know it.... :wink:

BUT (in death throes here)

...why call them knights of the stable when they are a far flung organisation and not directly related to anyone's "stable"?

[Robert Vermaat]

BUT (in death throes here)
...why call them knights of the stable when they are a far flung organisation and not directly related to anyone's "stable"?

How about this one?
"Marshal is a word used in several official titles of various branches of society. The word is an ancient loan word from Old (Norman) French, cf. modern French maréchal, which in turn is a borrowing from Old Frankish *marhskalk "stable boy, keeper, servant" :wink:

[Vindex]

How about this one?
"Marshal is a word used in several official titles of various branches of society. The word is an ancient loan word from Old (Norman) French, cf. modern French maréchal, which in turn is a borrowing from Old Frankish *marhskalk "stable boy, keeper, servant" :wink:

A bottle of claret down so not sure now if that helps or not!! :wink:

Does that mean a Field Marshal is actually a grass keeper...so, in effect, a lawn mower?!

EDIT: Just to prove a point on how far an interpretation can be taken LOL! :wink:

[Marcus Agrippa]

Nice discussion, but it seems it's more a like linguistic discussion than one based on primary sources. These seem to be sparse on the Equites Stablesiani ? ad:

[Aussum]

Taking the grooms theme further, and given the Romans love of forming new units from cadres, could not the Stablesiani be units formed from the grooms and assistants from other equites units? That would seem to be a source of trained horsemen and in a crisis, cavalry is cavalry. The ancient equivalent of arming cooks and musicians?

Austin

[Robert Vermaat]

Taking the grooms theme further, and given the Romans love of forming new units from cadres, could not the Stablesiani be units formed from the grooms and assistants from other equites units? That would seem to be a source of trained horsemen and in a crisis, cavalry is cavalry. The ancient equivalent of arming cooks and musicians?

I think I recall that that's the original theory behind this unit. New units formed from (I think I recall) the horse guards of the governors and other high civil servants who lost their military commands during the reign of Constantine.

[Vindex]

Robert - I've sent you a PM (I think)!

[Nathan Ross]

Just wanted to pick up this old thread for a moment.

I was thinking again about the origin of the term equites stablesiani: could it possibly mean something like 'garrison cavalry'?

These units could have been stationed (or 'stabled') at the various fortified posts along the road systems, or at shore forts like Burgh. The man of VI Stablesiani who lost/left his helmet at Deurne could been based on the Koln-Bavay road, for example, or at one of the forts down the Meuse.

Units taken into the field army often have regional links - perhaps the Equites Stablesiani Africani and Italicani listed in the ND under the western Magister Militum might originally have been the garrison cavalry from these provinces, brigaded together in some way?

[ValentinianVictrix]

Wasn't Valens an officer of this unit, I remember reading somewhere that he was and he held the rank of ‘Tribunus Stabuli’ .

[Nathan Ross]

he held the rank of ‘Tribunus Stabuli’ .

He did, I think. But this was a relatively high rank - there were only about eight 'tribunes of the stables', they were equal to tribunes of the scholae and attended upon the emperor. So it would seem unlikely that they commanded small cavalry units in frontier provinces.

[Urselius]

They were created in an age when "The whatever" often referred to "The Emperor's whatever", as is the case of domus, which, in certain contexts, meant "The Emperor's Household". That "The Stable" from which the Equites Stablesiani derive their name was "The Emperor's Stable" seems reasonable.

I read somewhere, memory fails here, that one theory for their creation was from stripping the legions of their integral cavalry element and then greatly recruiting the resulting cadre up in numbers. If this was the case then the legions would cease to be responsible for supporting these cavalrymen. Presumably the provision of pay, food, fodder, arms and remounts would then fall on the central administration - perhaps mediated by the emperor's equine establishment - perhaps referred to as "The Stable". Such cavalrymen would not necessarily have to be elite, but merely be administered directly by the imperial fisc.

Merely a little kite-flying

[Nathan Ross]

That "The Stable" from which the Equites Stablesiani derive their name was "The Emperor's Stable" seems reasonable.

Hmm, maybe That's assuming the word derives from a particular 'stable' (rather than being 'stabled' somewhere, or from another word...)

one theory for their creation was from stripping the legions of their integral cavalry element

Yes, that's the theory (can't recall whose, but Rance mentions it) that they were a western equivalent to the Equites Promoti.

Picking up on Moi's point above, it does seem at least plausible that the name has a connection with the latin stabilire or stabilis - to 'make firm' or 'stabilise', from which we get 'establish'. Although Duncan's note about the stablisianoi / stablêsianoi would support the 'stables' idea.

However, I still think either would work for a new-style cavalry unit based along lines of communication near the frontiers, as part of a 'defence in depth' arrangement.