The Skiritai - the \'Gurkhas\' of Sparta?

[Ghostmojo]

Since a few of us think this is a subject possibly worthy of its own thread - here it is!

Who were the Skiritai (sciritae); what did they do; how long did they survive; how did they originate? :?:

I'm not certain as to when this unit appeared originally but it was a fully-fledged 'mora' (600 men) in classical times and seems to have survived until the period of the rise of Thebes. However, following Leuktra/Mantinea we hear no more of it. I have always assumed this is because they were co-opted Arkadian troops from a border teritory near Lakonia and under the Theban hegemony were liberated from any previous duties or responsibilities to the Lakedaimonian authorities. They were reputed to have originated from an area called Skiritis - hence the name - but this has been questioned.

I've lifted this next bit from the Spolas/Linothorax thread since it may well fit here more comfortably (sic):

The linothorax and spolas debate is interesting and I thought the possible addition of the 'skiros' as another kind of body armour might give weight to the notion that different materials were tried and tested etc. If Chrimes is correct - that the Skiritai (sciritae) were so named because of their body armour being a leather (and not draped over the shoulders like a hamippoi) or animal 'skin'; rather than denoting their geographic origins - then perhaps some sort of jerkin was used?

The "skir" word root seems mostly to have to do with stony ground from a quick search I did, but I need to search more on this matter-no opinion yet on this.

I'm not sure about that Stefanos. It may well be true and/but coincidental. Perhaps the common root linking element means 'hard skin' or 'tough surface' which is sort of what Chrimes suggests.

Possibly this illustration from page 92 (15-d) of Duncan Head's (DH) Armies of the Macedonian and Punic Wars which shows such an item is something along the lines of what a 'skiros' type jerkin might have looked like [It is derived from an engraving on an early 4thC temple of Apollo at Bassai in Arkadia]. This is very different from the standard linothorax/spolas (15-main image/-b/-c). It is more like a moulded or shaped garment - perhaps mimicking metal:



This is clearly an aposite moment to repost an image I inserted somewhere on this site a few months back (an helmeted archaic warrior wearing what apears to be a lion or leopard skin):



Which is purported to show a warrior of the Skiritai (by K.M.T. Chrimes - Ancient Sparta [Pithos with Combat and Chariot scenes from Sparta]). She discusses the root meaning of the word 'Skiritai' - related to Athena Skiras; Artemis Skiris; and Dionysos Skiereios? This (mid 6thC) image is too early for the classical period Skiritai of the Spartan army, however, she points out that unit was known for wearing skins rather than armour (something of a traditional hangover from Homeric times). The suggestion was that originally it took the place of the shield, but by the classical period the Skiritai were using the shield as well (as part of the regular phalanx front line) as the pelt. This cladding was also often worn by heroes and deities associated with the chase (hunting).

Further to this is the fact that animal skins are mentioned as playing some part in the festivals of the Skirophoria. Chrimes summation is basically that the Skiritai warrior (if he is one) is shown midway in his development from Homeric animal-skin clad hurler of whatever happened to come to hand - towards fully fledged hoplite. The survival of the name (in her view) is that they continued to wear these corselets of animal skins even once they had become one of the Lakedaimonian hoplite morai, but remained more mobile due to the lighter armament than the other six heavy hoplite morai. It is interesting to note that the Spartans in the 4thC used the word αίγίϛ (aigis) to denote a breastplate in general (and that relates to the animal-skin covering characteristic of the Skiritai).

Their traditional and honoured position on the vulnerable left wing of the army may well date from that final realisation of them as well-protected but light hoplites. There is a certain question as to who exactly the Skiritai were. Suppositions vary from Lakedaimonians billeted in the locality of Skiritis (north of Sparta); Periokoi from that area of the northern Eurotas valley; or more likely (IMHO) recruited Arkadians serving within Lakedaimonian forces in a position of honour (like the British Gurkhas for example) who were obviously neither Spartan, Lakonian or even necessarily Dorian (but were Lakedaimonian by inclusion / incorporation). It is also possible (probable in KMTC's view) that the name actually has nothing to do with this place name - but to do with their costume. The name σκίροϛ (skiros) means tough or hard covering (non-metal) often relating to a 'skin'.

[PMBardunias]

The suggestion was that originally it took the place of the shield,

I think the fellow above is armed with a sling. See the way the left hand us cupped up, the right would be holding the sling taut.

Their traditional and honoured position on the vulnerable left wing of the army may well date from that final realisation of them as well-protected but light hoplites.

Where does the notion that they were more lightly armored rather than just more nimble come from? I don't think that the younger age classes of Spartans that at times were sent to run down peltasts were armed differently than the rest.

[Ghostmojo]

Their traditional and honoured position on the vulnerable left wing of the army may well date from that final realisation of them as well-protected but light hoplites.

Where does the notion that they were more lightly armored rather than just more nimble come from? I don't think that the younger age classes of Spartans that at times were sent to run down peltasts were armed differently than the rest.

Xenophon tell us the Skiritai (Σκιρῖται) were also used as scouts as well as hoplites, and as sentinels guarding the camp. They generally went ahead of the main army - although in smaller detachments. The younger Spartiates you mention that acted like Ekdromoi could well have been more lightly armed. The ranks opened up to allow these guys out which perhaps suggests they were not in the front line, and therefore perhaps not so heavily armoured/protected?

The notion of the Skiritai Lokhos being a more lightly armoured regiment comes from a number of sources. The primary one I have been referring too has been via K.M.T. Chrimes. However, she does admit to some confusion as to whether the whole unit operated as scouts or just a section of it. The 600 figure as opposed to the usual 512 of the politikai morai might account for this with the surplus 88 men being designated scouts who may well have cooperated with the cavalry.

[Giannis K. Hoplite]

I think the fellow above is armed with a sling. See the way the left hand us cupped up, the right would be holding the sling taut.

Paul! You are right! The man is using a sling! Typical greek stance, shown in vases and frescos. Interesting he is wearing a helmet, isn't it! And a crested one...
Khaire
Giannis

[Ghostmojo]

I think the fellow above is armed with a sling. See the way the left hand us cupped up, the right would be holding the sling taut.

Paul! You are right! The man is using a sling! Typical greek stance, shown in vases and frescos

Yes indeed. But that is not the point. The illustration was merely to indicate the use of 'skiros' type armour. He is a stone-thrower, but also carries a sword and as you point out; wears a helmet similar to his colleagues. Chrimes' contention is that this type of warrior might have been a proto-skirites. As I mentioned earlier he is part of a developing trend towards later becoming a light hoplite.

She backs this up with an examination of the name derivatives, which I have also drawn attention to. As Stefanos commented his research had fallen on stony ground! :wink: (sic). And K.M.T.C. postulates also that 'skiros' also refers to a limestone crust over the surface of the earth or any tough or hard covering.

[Lyceum]

Any feasible connection with white/threshing? I know the root Skr- has been repeatedly shown to be cognate with a wider PIE root for white (cf gothic shear) and that seems to be the reasoning behind some of the Athenian mythological characters with regards to threshing.

Though, frankly, etymological wrangling is a red-herring. The Roman word "cohort" derives from the same PIE root that gives garden/walled enclosure...I don't see how that's particularly helpful either.

[Macedon]

scirros is attested to have meant gypsum/plster and a scirites a plasterer. It is also given (sciros, sceiros also given as scyros) as thin pieces of stone like those left off after carving stone with a chisel. Hesychius gives even more meanings to the word, but I think that the ones above are what "should" be considered basic. There were a number of locations that were named with the use of the various spellings of the word like Sciros, Scyros, Sciritis as well as names of people. The most important location of that name was in nearby Attica, where it is supposed to have taken its name because of the whiteness of the ground.

It also meant "hat", especially by the Athenians who held a festival to the scirian Athena. I did not find any occurrence as some non-metallic garment, but I admit I did not make too thorough a search.

The Lacedaemonian unit of the sciritae (also given as scireitae) is attested to have been mustered from Sciros in Arcadia.

All the above information is given in the primary sources, if you guys feel you need them I will be glad to give more details or/and the texts themselves.

[Vindex]

Without wishing to seem unduly fussy, from your descriptions of this force I feel honour bound to contest the analogy with the Gurkhas.

They provide infantry battalions (or probably only one VERY small one if the bean counters get their way) and are equipped exactly the same as the British Army and totally assimilated in Brigades and battle groups with their tactics (but are not mechanised infantry). Until recently, however, they did not have the same T&Cs as their British counterparts.

They have a well earned reputation for their combat skills and are second to none in hand to hand fighting (ref Falkland Islands campaing 1982 as a most recent example).

Admittedly their inclusion in any deploying ORBAT has the same effect on the enemy as the inclusion of Spartan Hoplites in combined Greek forces; and some will even term them as simple mercenaries. But as a parallel to the Skiritai...I'm not convinced.

[Ghostmojo]

Without wishing to seem unduly fussy, from your descriptions of this force I feel honour bound to contest the analogy with the Gurkhas.

They provide infantry battalions (or probably only one VERY small one if the bean counters get their way) and are equipped exactly the same as the British Army and totally assimilated in Brigades and battle groups with their tactics (but are not mechanised infantry). Until recently, however, they did not have the same T&Cs as their British counterparts.

They have a well earned reputation for their combat skills and are second to none in hand to hand fighting (ref Falkland Islands campaing 1982 as a most recent example).

Admittedly their inclusion in any deploying ORBAT has the same effect on the enemy as the inclusion of Spartan Hoplites in combined Greek forces; and some will even term them as simple mercenaries. But as a parallel to the Skiritai...I'm not convinced.

Well, I could have used Paul's metaphorical term as Highlanders, but I didn't.

The choice of 'Gurkhas' was merely meant to suggest that the Skiritai were 'others' (non-Dorian/non-Lakonian - from a mountainous origin) within an otherwise largely heterogeneous framework. There was no other serious reference intended. I'm well aware of the history and reputation of the Gurkhas, and as somebody who will watch anything that Joanna Lumley is in - who could forget the wonderful moment she made government minsters wince and nod along with her 'demands' for terms and conditions for them?

There are possible parallels, however, regarding citizenship rights; being led by 'foreign' officers; and ultimately many choosing to leave British service when presented with the opportunity (choosing Indian Army instead), like the Skiritai left their Spartan masters around 371BC etc.; but this is not a subject I really want to explore greatly as it will take us away from the prime subject of discussion.

The Skiritai were also largely armed and equipped as per their Spartiate and Periokoi compatriots, and fought as part of the regular hoplite phalanx line. However, there were notable differences - which is what we are discussing here.

[Robert Vermaat]

They have a well earned reputation for their combat skills and are second to none in hand to hand fighting (ref Falkland Islands campaing 1982 as a most recent example).

Although I fully agree with what you're saying about the Ghurkas, the example was perhaps not the best - the Gurkhas never saw any actual fighting and felt quite cheated. There were no fatalities. In fact the Argentines seem to have fled due to the ghurkas fierce reputation. Not a bad thing by itself! But some Ghurkas would surely have wished it they would have been less frighthening, resulting in a bit of action. :wink:

[Vindex]

Points taken - but I won't go on because as Howard says, that's not the thrust of the thread.

[Ghostmojo]

They have a well earned reputation for their combat skills and are second to none in hand to hand fighting (ref Falkland Islands campaing 1982 as a most recent example).

Although I fully agree with what you're saying about the Ghurkas, the example was perhaps not the best - the Gurkhas never saw any actual fighting and felt quite cheated. There were no fatalities. In fact the Argentines seem to have fled due to the ghurkas fierce reputation. Not a bad thing by itself! But some Ghurkas would surely have wished it they would have been less frighthening, resulting in a bit of action.

And without wishing to get too political (because I know that is a no-no around here!); perhaps if we entrusted the defence and safety of The Falkland Islands to these redoubtable warriors - we (and the residents of Port Stanley) could sleep more easily nowadays! :-o hock: :roll: :lol: :wink:

Now - back to the Skiritai ...

[PMBardunias]

Points taken - but I won't go on because as Howard says, that's not the thrust of the thread.

Keeping in mind the similarity (relationship?) between the Kukri and Khopis, I'd say more a chop than a thrust.

[Vindex]

:wink:

Doesn't make for good English though, does it!

[Marc320]

Hello all

And if this famous vase represented just one of these heroized fights of Iliade during which one of the Gods (wearing a goatskin as the Aegis) took their part - the divin stone's throw is there frequent?

And if the Skiritai had been used by the Spartans - at a moment when their ranks had melted away because they will even manage to use Helotes in their ranks (Neodamodes)- in the same way as Hannibal used the Gauls by drawing up them in the place the most exposed by the fight?


Marc