Segmentata waist plate length variations.

[Titus Marius Secundus]

Hello,
I am just finishing preparing my cardboard mock-up plates for a segmentata. I have done the upper two sections for girdle plates, and shoulders, but the "barrel" or waist area I need some advice on. I know both right and left sections have shorter and longer lengths for overlap, but I would like to know whether it's been done, to shorten the plates lower down, and or increase those upper to make breathing room for lung expansion,without increasing the whole suit of armor just for a area.
I am taking into consideration of a night gown as a pretend tunic. I would probably make a tunic and subarmalis before the "real thing" but as it's only cardboard I think a gown is alright.

I hope the answer isn't obvious, but thought I'd best check This is the beneficiary of "tailoring" my own suit right?
One more quick question, 18 gauge is recommended, but I've heard 20 gauge is recommended for the shoulder sections....Is this strongly suggested, or when I do make it, a 18 is good all around...?

Thanks in advance,

Sam

[PhilusEstilius]

Sam.

I am trying to understand what you mean about the left and right having longer and shorter lengths for overlap, all girdle plates left and right sides should be equal lengths for you have the same overlap at both front and rear on a segmentata.
Then of course you make it as you would any garment allowing for waist and chest measurements, the better way to make the girdle is in fact to make it from bottom or waist upward this way you work out the horizontal overlap as you go up.

In my own opinion I do not think that soldiers would wear a subarmalis under a segmentata, then for breathing space it's better to just make it one inch bigger than your actual measurements all around.
The better thickness is 20 gauge and forget this foolish idea that a segmentata was anywhere near 18 gauge, I would even say that I think most segmentata were only around 22 gauge with the sheet metal hand beaten to make it as a stressed finish.

[Titus Marius Secundus]

Thank you Brian,

I mean as the abdominal section in in both right and left half's, and the legio XX site and other descriptions have led me to believe that either the right or the left half will have plates of a length of 20-1/2" inches, while the conjoining side will around 18-3/4" in length. This is to allow, apparently, the shorter-in-length plates to join over the other side, when tied together. The shorter side has the lacing loops placed close to the edge as to close over, while the longer side of plates have the lacing loops about an inch inside from the edge to allow the other side to come over. Making that solid join.
I suppose you don't need one side to necessarily be longer the other other abdominal half, as long as one side has the lacing loops placed an inch inside from the edge. I am thinking though that this won't have the same effect. This is what I mean, in the diagram the LEFT plate is shorter than the right, with loops close to edge, vise versa. If this isn't correct, accurate, or efficient, hopefully your expertise can help

Sam

[PhilusEstilius]

Sam.

I still can't get my head around this idea where you say that one plate is 20-1/2" and the other is 18-3/4" in length, the two plates for the waist as with all other opposite plates of a girdle should be equal in length.
The fasteners are placed so that one is near the edge of a plate and the other fastener is set away from the edge to whatever you want the overlap to be. Then when both plates are put together and tied you have the overlap equal at both front and rear of the armour.
The edges of the fasteners that are going to touch when the plates go together should be at your waist size plus 1 inch and so forth all the way up to the chest.
The segmetata looks the same at both front and back and the only thing that shows which is the front or rear is the hook arrangements if a B type, ie two hooks per top plate for the back and one hook per top plate for the front.

[PhilusEstilius]

Sam.

I still can't get my head around this idea where you say that one plate is 20-1/2" and the other is 18-3/4" in length, the two plates for the waist as with all other opposite plates of a girdle should be equal in length.
The fasteners are placed so that one is near the edge of a plate and the other fastener is set away from the edge to whatever you want the overlap to be. Then when both plates are put together and tied you have the overlap equal at both front and rear of the armour.
The edges of the fasteners that are going to touch when the plates go together should be at your waist size plus 1 inch and so forth all the way up to the chest.
The segmetata looks the same at both front and back and the only thing that shows which is the front or rear is the hook arrangements if a B type, ie two hooks per top plate for the back and one hook per top plate for the front.

[Titus Marius Secundus]

Ok thanks, I understand what you're saying, and what I was saying doesn't really matter as overlap can be achieved either way. mile: I trust the originals were all the same length, and that in reproductions all the plates should be the same length all throughout the chest and waist. I.E the plates up near the chest, and those down at the waist, are the same cut as those at the thinnest part of my waist, that'll have the most slack. So lets not make anything too complicated. I really think I'm grasping the picture now :lol:

Thaaaank you Brian.

[PhilusEstilius]

The plates should not all be the same length top to bottom but should be made as any other garment, check out your waist wearing tunica give an extra inch then get some one to get the other measurements for mid chest and just above breast line and give again an extra inch for these.
The idea of the extra inch all around is that as you walk or march around your chest expands from the more breathing you do.