Although I may not be purchasing these just yet, I would like to have an idea of what I am getting. From the bottom of my leg to just over my knee is 17-17.5" (43.2-44.5cm)
They are 20" (50.8cm) overall, but since they are made to extend to part of the thigh would they be ok? I think they would be, but I want to check with you guys before I dish out a good chunk of money on something that may not fit.
Although I feel they have more of a Roman theme to them, which would double well with my Legionary impression. The Deepeeka one I know would fit me alright as it is much smaller, however it does not cover the knee, which correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that very important for a Greek military impression? The other DSC one is more of a Roman Centurion's greaves, but because they "tie" on rather than "enclose" the entire leg are they unacceptable by Greek standards? I know a considerable amount of Greek history, however my Greek military equipment is lagging, so please bear with me
The DSC greaves aren't to everybody's liking. They are not the ideal shape and take a little "persuasion" for them to fit better. That being said, as I have already mentioned in another thread, for the money I do believe they are good. Bear in mind though that they are not going to be a perfect fit as the only way this is achievable is to have some tailor made to measure each individual leg.
It also depends on what you plan to do whilst wearing them. For more sedantry work they are fine, but if you do a lot of running then they may work loose and even come off as they are supplied. I also found that the felt lining they came with was a little too rough and in warmer weather my legs sweated a lot. Therefore this was ripped out and replaced with some kid hide and they are much better for it. Also I replaced the trim with red leather instead of the stock brown.
Also they do dig into the top of my feet a lot but some thin lightweight linen bandaged around my ankles prevents this and I can wear them quite comfortably for several hours at a time.
Here is a picture of my pair after the modifications I mentioned.
Thanks Dienekes, I do not plan on running a marathon in them, but I would need them to stay in place, even if I have to have some additional lining added while I walked, walked long distances even. For the most part, nothing more than simply walking around an event or the house.
If you don't mind me asking, I saw your photo in the "Show us your Greek Impression" thread, I noticed how far these went up your leg, about how tall is you leg from the base to the top of your knee?
Also, thanks to Theo, somehow I forgot to recall the LegioXX site, a sacrilege to us Roman Reenactors! lol
No problem, Matt :-) I STILL find things on his site that I can't find in my books.
Quote:For more sedantry work they are fine, but if you do a lot of running then they may work loose and even come off as they are supplied.
Might this have been a real problem for the Greeks? I read that the Alexander Sarcophagus shows a couple of infantrymen (Hypaspists ?) wearing a red band below the knee to secure the greaves. The actual panel might be this one. I'm guessing the original colors on the sarcophagus were determined through some special analysis because I can't see red bands.
Quote:Thanks Dienekes, I do not plan on running a marathon in them, but I would need them to stay in place, even if I have to have some additional lining added while I walked, walked long distances even. For the most part, nothing more than simply walking around an event or the house.
If you don't mind me asking, I saw your photo in the "Show us your Greek Impression" thread, I noticed how far these went up your leg, about how tall is you leg from the base to the top of your knee?
Also, thanks to Theo, somehow I forgot to recall the LegioXX site, a sacrilege to us Roman Reenactors! lol
Well I wouldn't be running a Marathon either, even without them lol. It sounds like you'll be doing much the same work with them that I do and you may find them ok for that.
I wouldn't say I have particularly long legs, but from the base to the top of my knee is 17 inches.
Quote:Might this have been a real problem for the Greeks? I read that the Alexander Sarcophagus shows a couple of infantrymen (Hypaspists ?) wearing a red band below the knee to secure the greaves. The actual panel might be this one. I'm guessing the original colors on the sarcophagus were determined through some special analysis because I can't see red bands.
~Theo
It's entirely possible I suppose, but I must admit I haven't seen this anywhere else that I can recall. But we are certainly aware of the bandaging around the ankles so I don't see why not. Would it have been likely that every single hoplite would have perfectly fitting "made to measure" greaves? In my mind, I don't think so, and even if it were the case, would they have stayed that way particularly after seeing action/being struck in battle etc.
Perhaps this is something that could be tested but given how much money and time would go into fabricating a pair of made to measure greaves, I'm not sure there are many out there that would then be prepared to batter them to hell and see if they still fit as well after!
Well, not really, i'm affraid. Every single pair of greaves was fitting the wearer perfect, and each greave of a pair was different in size and shape to fit the legs. The legs of a person are never identical and even if you can usualy not see the difference, there can be a considerable one between your two legs (see older threads on making greaves).
Every single pair of greaves that has been found beautifully demonstrates these details in the wearer's anatomy.
It is true that in the late 4th century greaves had some time bandages around the ankle and under the knee. Our evidence is not only artistic representations but actual greaves with a different corrosion around those areas.
These leather bands didn't mean any lesser fit of the greaves. For instance a macedonain Prince's greaves (Alexander's son himself) had this green corrosion under the knee, and Alexander's son's greaves would have surely fitted well!
The bands were probably largely fashion, and thus only apear in the late 4th century, whereas the style of the greaves has hardly changed.
The most probable use of the leather stripes must have been that they replaced the ankle paddings that were previously used by some men. These paddings were primarily supporting the weight of the greave rather than just intervening between the wearer's skin and the metal.
That the greaves had to be reshaped carefully every time before use is uttested by ancient writers. And i really do not see how a greave could be consistently battered.
In any case, a person that owns a ferrari has the funds to repair it when necessary, and the greaves were an accessory of the wealthy and a status symbol.
Khairete
Giannis
Giannis K. Hoplite
a.k.a.:Giannis Kadoglou
a.k.a.:Thorax
I don't doubt that greaves were made to measure but whether they stayed that way for the individual is what I would question.
To reshape the metal after damage would gradually become harder the more times the metal was subjected to the annealing process. The spring fit and "elasticity" of the metal comes from being annealed and work hardened otherwise they would not return to their original shape after each wear. It would not be possible to simply reshape them through beating them every time and continued annealing eventually leads to some loss of integrity of the metal. Therefore, there would come a point where the fit would be compromised in some way. Perhaps at that point the wealthy individual would have another pair made.
The reshaping of the greaves before each wear that i mentioned above is not a reworking of the metal, just an adjusting of the width of the greave and perhaps even a slight untwisting.
I don't see why you have this view that a greave would get much abuse anything like often.
Lastly, the legs is a part of the body that only slightly changes in the pass of time, compared to other parts-like the belly.
What i'm argueing is that in my belief, when an ancient warrior wore his greaves, these were fitting him perfectly every time. The use of stripes was not to improve the fit or replace it, but it is another proof that even a greatly fitting greave will have the tendency to fall downwards in violent moving of the legs. Earlier in the fifth century they beat this with ankle paddings that support the greave from the bottom. In the 4th and 3rd century they use the leather stripes, but the greaves have almost not changed at all.
Khaire
Giannis
Giannis K. Hoplite
a.k.a.:Giannis Kadoglou
a.k.a.:Thorax
Thanks guys, you convinced me that with a little bit of customization with the interior padding and ankle "wrap" that these would be the way to go. They should be here by the end of the week. Now that I'm almost done with exams I will hopefully be able to put some more time into my Greek impression, and although it might be a little bit of a stretch, using these greaves for my Roman Dacian campaign impression
Greaves arrived today, I really like them, but because I am a bit short, these when I stand perfectly straight my thigh sort of pushes the upper part of the greave off. However if I am in a combat stance with one leg in front and using the other to brace my stance they feel much better. I can run in them but it is a little awkward. And I absolutely agree that with you Dienekes that they would benefit from some "ankle wrap" as they do sort of pinch. I got a great price for them too used so even better
Does anyone know if they are based on a a real artifact or if they just follow the traditional greave model? Thanks
![[Image: -side-1.gif]](http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o118/kadoglou_gr/-side-1.gif)
