Miltiades\' helmet

[Jona Lendering]

In Olympia, a helmet was excavated that was used by one Miltiades. It is almost certainly the famous Athenian, and the romantic first interpretation was that he wore it during the battle of Marathon. To the best of my knowledge, this is not true; it was probably dedicated after an earlier campaign.

At the moment, I am editing an article in which the object is mentioned, and attributed to Marathon. There is no discussion; the author has no doubts. She may well be right, but does anyone know about arguments why the helmet was used at Marathon? Or am I (as so often) too skeptical?

[Giannis K. Hoplite]

Forgive my ignorance,but what exactly is the evidence for the helmet not having been used at Marathon? The layer on which it was found? Other objects found around it? And where was it found? As far as i know the dating if finds from Olympia is usually very problematic.
I would also be sceptical to leave such a statement as that it was certainly dedicated after marathon unedited. A "perhaps" might be advisable?
Khaire
Giannis

[Jona Lendering]

I really don't know the debate; I only remember that the initial optimism was, at some point, diminished for a more common-sense approach. An argument I would find convincing - but I do not know whether it is correct - is that there is no Marathon monument in Olympia. (There was one in Delphi, but was there one in Olympia?)

The man must have fought several battles, so there were several opportunities to dedicate this helmet. And my first remark would be: which Miltiades? Is the name sufficiently rare to accept that the man of the helmet was the man who fought at Marathon?

[Giannis K. Hoplite]

I have not run across the same name in any ancient text and i consider it uncommon,like Perikles,Kimon etc.
Miltiades seems to have dedicated the helmet to the temple of Zeus (MILTIADES ANETHEKEN TO DII) which was the biggest and most important temple in the whole complex of Olympia,so there wasn't needed any special treasury or monument there. Also,the Athenian treasury in Delphi was filled with the persian spoils only after 479 bc. It is worth noting that it was in Olympia that a persian helmet was found dedicated by the Athenians (ATHENAOI MEDON LAVONTES)and it is quite probable i would say that it was dedicated after Marathon and not after 479bc.
But i am really interested to see the clues that it was dedicated before Marathon,because i have heard this much time ago.
I can't think of a major victory of Miltiades before Marathon. Certainly not over the Persians. And as for his power in the Hellespond,i think he inherited from his father,also called Miltiades. (ha! could it be dedicated by his father???!!)
Khaire
Giannis

[MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS]

Any images of this helmet and its inscription if any ?

M.VIB.M.

[hoplite14gr]

The helmet in question.

[attachment=1311]DSC02337.JPG[/attachment]


Note:weapons were inherited from father to son.
The Philaidae clan had Olympic champions in chariot races from the early archaic age.
The ancestors had almost demigod status.
What would have stopped Miltiades dedicating an ancestors helmet?

Also in the 3 tombs of Marathon some items are earlier that the time of the battle.
That means that families gave ancient relics as offerings to the dead.

I suspect that some of Johna's colleagues are trying to lead him to a "fool's errant" pehaps to have fun at his expense.

Kind regards

[Jona Lendering]

To be fair, I think "Marathon" is indeed plausible; yet, it is not sufficiently plausible to accept it as uncontestedly true. There are two plausbible alternatives:

1. Miltiades the Elder fought a war against Lampsacus, which had, for him personally, a very happy outcome; he also celebrated an Olympic victory (Hdt. 6.36, 6.103)
   
2. Miltiades the Younger conquered Lemnus (Hdt. 6.136-140)
   

Cimon the Elder (halfbrother of the first Miltiades, father of the second Miltiades) also won a victory at Olympia, and may - as has been suggested above - have dedicated a heirloom.

In short, I think that "this helmet was dedicated after Marathon" needs additional arguments.

[Gulan]

I believe this is not his fathers' helmet but his own..WHy? Not because there was anything to stop him but because his father died in 524 BC, it means he probably used his helmet(s) in 550-530 BC period...And the type of the Miltiades helmet from Olympia looks more like those 500 BC ish types,later type in Corinthian helmet evolution, not like half 6th c BC types.

Just an observation..might be wrong...or be giving too much credit to the dating system :grin:

[MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS]

And who says there were not more Greek soldiers called Miltiades ?

If the inscription would have said:

Miltiades the Strategos has dedicated this after the battle of...........

it would be a different story. Now we only know that there was someone called Miltiades who dedicated a helmet at some stage in the history of the sanctuary of Olympos....

This is about as strange as deciding a silver inlaid disc found in the Netherlands is to be attested to the Roman officer Gaius Aquilius Proculus who was mentioned by Tacitus in connection to the Batavian revolt, as if there were not more people named so and so....

http://www.flickr.com/photos/antiekpubliek/3853900622/



M.VIB.M.

[Giannis K. Hoplite]

Actually no, it wasn't that random. First of all "Miltiades" is not a name that we frequently come across in greek history. Only the famous one and his father have been recorded with this name.
Second, it is not a small deal to dedicate a helmet in the biggest sanctuary in greece and one of the biggest in the world, with your own name written on it. Those things counted a lot back then. We often see names of famous tyrants, and even more often names of cities who dedicated a helmet or a shield on the sanctuary.
The man who dedicated this helmet was a great man with a lot of money and influence, who did something great. How many such men do you know, that were called "Miltiades"?
Granted, we will never know for sure, but it is more than probable that Miltiades the Strategos at one point was in the same place as this helmet. Perhaps he even kept it in his hands, and who knows, he might even have worn it once. It could be a trophy rather than his own helmet. Or it could have saved his life from a terrible Persian stroke on the head. Or it belonged to a big Medized Greek. In any case it is a very significant find, and you don't do it justice to say that it could have belonged to a common soldier.
Khaire
Giannis

[MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS]

Oh by no means did I mean that it belonged to a common soldier. I just am cautious to attest it to the great Miltiades.

M.VIB.M.

[Darth_Roach]

I wonder whom that other helmet belonged to. Looks like an Assyrian design but without the short, solid cheek/ear guards.

[Paralus]

Looks like an Assyrian design but without the short, solid cheek/ear guards.

Perhaps belonging to one of those "Anušiya - the ten thousand" and a subsequent donative by one the 5,000 Spartans at Plataea?

[Darth_Roach]

There were 10k hoplites on the right, even if only 5k were Spartans.

Her. 9.28.2
On the right wing were ten thousand Lacedaemonians; five thousand of these, who were Spartans, had a guard of thirty-five thousand light-armed helots, seven appointed for each man.

But how is your slight related to the helmet?

[Paralus]

There were 10k hoplites on the right, even if only 5k were Spartans.

Her. 9.28.2
On the right wing were ten thousand Lacedaemonians; five thousand of these, who were Spartans, had a guard of thirty-five thousand light-armed helots, seven appointed for each man.

But how is your slight related to the helmet?

The slight is - evidently - in the eye of the beholder.

As for your bolding of Herodotus 9.28.2, this is exculpatory sophistry. Herodotus makes absolutely plain that there were only 5,000 homoioi or Spartans in the force: τούτων δὲ τοὺς πεντακισχιλίους ἐόντας Σπαρτιήτας. The other 5,000 were clearly not Spartans.