Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes
#19
Quote:The idea that using an overhand grip gave just enough energy to increase the chance of penetrating armour isn't completely convincing: not all hoplites had body armour; those who did had lots of unarmoured targets like the face, neck, thighs, and shoulders;


It still takes power to penetrate the human body, if all things were equal a strike that will on avaerage be more powerful will be a benefit- i.e. if my "glancing" blows are sticking three inches into your face while yours get stuck im my cheek bone, I win.

Quote:and while ancient armour was light its not obvious that a one-handed thrust could penetrate it.

There are many vase images showing this- armor penetrated with blood spewing forth. I would be suprised if it were fantasy.

Quote:Paul, again, could I have the source for the 4:1 difference in energy between overhand and underhand strikes?


Oops,I thought I had, here some data from Connolly et al. JOURNAL OF BATTLEFIELD TECHNOLOGY, VOL 4, NO 2, NOVEMBER 2001. The study was very well done. They compared from top to bottom: overhand,the type of high underhand that C. Mathew recently recommended for hoplites (Historia 2009),and low underhand.

[attachment=675]Spearthrustdata.JPG[/attachment]


And here's an image I just whipped up by bastardizing Johnny's excellent illustrations to show the range of targets for high, left, and low, right, overhand strikes. You can still hit the often exposed right thigh and feet as well as coming into the face from below. Note that the shield raised with the bottom tilted up and forward would present the face perpendicular to these descending blows. Perhaps this is why we see it.

[attachment=677]Highandlowoverhandtargets.JPG[/attachment]


Attached Files Thumbnail(s)
           
Paul M. Bardunias
MODERATOR: [url:2dqwu8yc]http://www.romanarmytalk.com/rat/viewtopic.php?t=4100[/url]
A Spartan, being asked a question, answered "No." And when the questioner said, "You lie," the Spartan said, "You see, then, that it is stupid of you to ask questions to which you already know the answer!"
Reply


Messages In This Thread
Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by rrgg - 04-14-2011, 10:45 AM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by Macedon - 04-15-2011, 06:06 PM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by Macedon - 04-22-2011, 01:23 AM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by rrgg - 04-22-2011, 03:38 AM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by Paralus - 04-23-2011, 05:32 AM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by rrgg - 04-23-2011, 01:24 PM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by Macedon - 04-26-2011, 01:48 AM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by rrgg - 04-26-2011, 12:50 PM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by Macedon - 04-26-2011, 02:54 PM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by PMBardunias - 04-26-2011, 10:48 PM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by George - 04-27-2011, 04:45 AM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by rrgg - 04-27-2011, 01:59 PM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by George - 04-27-2011, 08:04 PM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by George - 04-27-2011, 08:29 PM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by George - 04-27-2011, 11:05 PM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by Paralus - 04-28-2011, 04:00 PM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by abou - 01-02-2014, 08:02 PM
Re: Depictions of Underarm Phalanxes - by Macedon - 01-02-2014, 08:25 PM

Possibly Related Threads…
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  The Macedonian phalanx: overarm or underarm? Justin Swanton 3 3,438 03-13-2018, 03:05 AM
Last Post: Michael J. Taylor
  Flexibility of various Greek/Hellenic phalanxes. FarDarter 20 8,458 02-25-2016, 08:14 AM
Last Post: Paralus

Forum Jump: