05-04-2011, 11:38 PM
Great photos, John!
I can see where you might have problems with the length & bulk of these Orlat-styled quiver/cases. You certainly had a more exciting weekend than I did at the traditional archery symposium.
Here is more stuff I can add to my theory that the Orlat plaque and the Chinese-styled swords found in the Ural-to-Don regions, and again in the Bosphorus, are all connected. Perhaps even pinpointed to the battle of 162BC in the Ili Valley. The conflict had the Wusun (aka Massagetae/Alans) with help from Laoshang's Xiongnu (Huns) fighting the Yuechi who were approaching from the east or right-hand side of the plaque. The Novosibum articles identify the armor as Massagetae, but all three tribes lived adjacent to one another. Here are some close-up pics of two swords:
[attachment=804]orlatswords002.JPG[/attachment]
[attachment=805]orlatswords004.JPG[/attachment]
The two swords have long two-handed grips, about 20 to 22cm, and the pommels show the a shape described today as "disc" or "diamond." The artist depicted the bows and bow-cases exactly correct in detail. So, then, he also showed accurate sword features.
Here are photos of Late Warring States and Han Chinese pommels, plus the one on my reproduction:
[attachment=806]orlatswords008.JPG[/attachment]
They are all early styles, and variants on the diamond or disc theme.
Here are the sword grips, showing pommels and the grip-guards, although the guards are not jade but brass (I can't afford jade):
[attachment=807]orlatswords012.JPG[/attachment]
These grips are 20 to 22cm long and the top two derive from the original swords now in museums. Top: Zhan Gao sword, late Warring States. Middle: Emperor Wudi sword, c. 150BC. And Bottom: my Wusun Cavalry sword.
These swords are similar to the early Sarmatian examples, especially the Aksai Kurgan 2 sword at the Volga-Don, "not earlier than 150BC" and with a 22cm grip. That's why I think the imperial Chinese swords, the Orlat swords, and the Volga-Don and Bosporus swords, all have a common root.
I can see where you might have problems with the length & bulk of these Orlat-styled quiver/cases. You certainly had a more exciting weekend than I did at the traditional archery symposium.
Here is more stuff I can add to my theory that the Orlat plaque and the Chinese-styled swords found in the Ural-to-Don regions, and again in the Bosphorus, are all connected. Perhaps even pinpointed to the battle of 162BC in the Ili Valley. The conflict had the Wusun (aka Massagetae/Alans) with help from Laoshang's Xiongnu (Huns) fighting the Yuechi who were approaching from the east or right-hand side of the plaque. The Novosibum articles identify the armor as Massagetae, but all three tribes lived adjacent to one another. Here are some close-up pics of two swords:
[attachment=804]orlatswords002.JPG[/attachment]
[attachment=805]orlatswords004.JPG[/attachment]
The two swords have long two-handed grips, about 20 to 22cm, and the pommels show the a shape described today as "disc" or "diamond." The artist depicted the bows and bow-cases exactly correct in detail. So, then, he also showed accurate sword features.
Here are photos of Late Warring States and Han Chinese pommels, plus the one on my reproduction:
[attachment=806]orlatswords008.JPG[/attachment]
They are all early styles, and variants on the diamond or disc theme.
Here are the sword grips, showing pommels and the grip-guards, although the guards are not jade but brass (I can't afford jade):
[attachment=807]orlatswords012.JPG[/attachment]
These grips are 20 to 22cm long and the top two derive from the original swords now in museums. Top: Zhan Gao sword, late Warring States. Middle: Emperor Wudi sword, c. 150BC. And Bottom: my Wusun Cavalry sword.
These swords are similar to the early Sarmatian examples, especially the Aksai Kurgan 2 sword at the Volga-Don, "not earlier than 150BC" and with a 22cm grip. That's why I think the imperial Chinese swords, the Orlat swords, and the Volga-Don and Bosporus swords, all have a common root.
Alan J. Campbell
member of Legio III Cyrenaica and the Uncouth Barbarians
Author of:
The Demon's Door Bolt (2011)
Forging the Blade (2012)
"It's good to be king. Even when you're dead!"
Old Yuezhi/Pazyrk proverb
member of Legio III Cyrenaica and the Uncouth Barbarians
Author of:
The Demon's Door Bolt (2011)
Forging the Blade (2012)
"It's good to be king. Even when you're dead!"
Old Yuezhi/Pazyrk proverb
