Quote:Could that fellow in the animal skin on the vase be Herakles? It might help explain some of the other "archaic" (not necessarily "Archaic"!) features
KMTC doesn't mention Herakles, Matt. She is scrupulously thorough in most other respects. That particular character doesn't really look like any representations I've seen of H before.
[size=75:2kpklzm3]Ghostmojo / Howard Johnston[/size]
[size=75:2kpklzm3]Xerxes - "What did the guy in the pass say?" ... Scout - "Μολὼν λαβέ my Lord - and he meant it!!!"[/size]
Some images of animal skins as shown on vases. Some of them are Laconian,but not all of them show it in military context.
[attachment=71]042_MGE_16439_BS_go.jpg[/attachment]
My favorite vest-form hide armorish thing with leopard codpiece.
Paul M. Bardunias
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A Spartan, being asked a question, answered "No." And when the questioner said, "You lie," the Spartan said, "You see, then, that it is stupid of you to ask questions to which you already know the answer!"
Quote:My favorite vest-form hide armorish thing with leopard codpiece.
Judging by the wine jar, the 'thyrsus' and the leopardskin - all attributes of Dionysius- that is a depiction of that God or one of his priests/accolytes.......
"dulce et decorum est pro patria mori " - Horace
(It is a sweet and proper thing to die for ones country)
"No son-of-a-bitch ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country" - George C Scott as General George S. Patton
Paul McDonnell-Staff
Quote:Judging by the wine jar, the 'thyrsus' and the leopardskin - all attributes of Dionysius- that is a depiction of that God or one of his priests/accolytes.......
I think you are right and one of them wears leather as well, but of a very different cut. See attached.
I also uploaded one of the best images of a man using a hide for a shield.
Paul M. Bardunias
MODERATOR: [url:2dqwu8yc]http://www.romanarmytalk.com/rat/viewtopic.php?t=4100[/url]
A Spartan, being asked a question, answered "No." And when the questioner said, "You lie," the Spartan said, "You see, then, that it is stupid of you to ask questions to which you already know the answer!"
Quote:Just answered my own question about Homeric leather armour. There are a few references to leather helmets but this is the only reference to leather armour that I can find.
Lattimore's translation: "and Simoeis, where much ox-hide armour and helmets"
Ressurect old thread to correct this statement.
Lattimore interpreted the term βοάγρια as leather armour but "hide shields" is a better fit. The same term is used in the Odyssey [16.296] and is referring to shields, not armour. If this is the correct translation then there isn't a single reference to leather armour anywhere in the Iliad.
Protection with the use of hides -especially for light troops appears in art.
There is plenty of evidence that leather or hide was used as armour in various places and times but there are very few illustrations that are detailed enough to determine the material from which a particular item is made. Better off to look at archaeological finds and references in texts.
The first one is a brass cuirass painted black. The second one is definately pure fantasy,even only regarding stylistic criteria, let alone material.
Khaire
Giannis
Giannis K. Hoplite
a.k.a.:Giannis Kadoglou
a.k.a.:Thorax
If you are referring only to metal armour,the answer is "probably yes". Multi colour artistic representations often show painted helmets.And some of the vases could be interpreted as painted armour,although they can't be used as evidence,especially if we don't have supportive evidence from other forms of art.
Khaire
Giannis
Giannis K. Hoplite
a.k.a.:Giannis Kadoglou
a.k.a.:Thorax