Lucius Verus with Commodus as heir

[Epictetus]

I find this timeline curious:

161 – Marcus and Lucius Verus become co-emperors
161 – Lucius Verus engaged to Marcus’ daughter.
161 – Commodus born to Marcus.
162 – Annius Verus born to Marcus.
163-164 – Lucius Verus marries Marcus’ daughter.
165 – Lucius Verus has baby girl.
166 – Commodus and Annius Verus made Caesars.

Marcus’ young boys were made Caesar while Lucius Verus was still alive. Moreover, there was every possibility that Lucius Verus would have sons in the future (he had one later, in fact, but the boy died young). The Historia Augusta states:

…Lucius demanded that Marcus triumph with him, and demanded also that the name Caesar should be given to Marcus' sons.

Marcus Aurelius, 12.8

This seems odd to me. Why would Lucius Verus “demand” the naming of Marcus’ male children as Caesars?

[D B Campbell]

Marcus’ young boys were made Caesar while Lucius Verus was still alive.

If I understand you correctly, you seem to imply that this would have been an insult to Lucius Verus. But he outranked them as Augustus, "emperor".

Moreover, there was every possibility that Lucius Verus would have sons in the future ...

And they would, presumably, have become Caesar, too.

Why would Lucius Verus “demand” the naming of Marcus’ male children as Caesars?

I don't know. But it doesn't seem odd or sinister to me. It is simply a mark of respect, isn't it? (Or am I missing something? It's very cold in Glasgow, and my brain may not be functioning fully. :wink: )

[Epictetus]

Maybe I'm just being cynical. By all accounts the two worked together better than probably any other imperial partners throughout Rome's history. Still, I think it strange that one emperor would want (or even "demand") the sons of his partner to be declared heirs. I don't know how long Lucius Verus' son lived, but as far as I am aware he was never declared Caesar.

Maybe I'm so used to emperors spending all their time trying to kill each other that this happy partnership seems so odd. It's almost too good to be true.

[Vindex]

If this is the 12:8 you have quoted where the word "demand" has appeared in translation...

"Corona praeterea civica oblata est ambobus; petitque Lucius, ut secum Marcus triumpharet. petit praetera Lucius, ut filii Marci Caesares appellarentur."

One's own translation can find "petitque" and "petit" as:

pet.it V 3 1 PRES ACTIVE IND 3 S
peto, petere, petivi, petitus V (3rd) [XXXAX]
attack; aim at; desire; beg, entreat, ask (for); reach towards, make for;


not necessarily "demand"

Just a suggestion to remove the need for cynicism perhaps?

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

I have the impression these were stock statements meant to convey the loyalty of the other partner in a political relationship. It seems to crop up quite a bit.