Metal plate beneath Linothorakes or Spolades

[PMBardunias]

I take evidence as valid, and sometimes conclusive, whereas hypotheses that lack evidence, or fly in the face of it,

Back on topic, what evidence does this fly in the face of? Since we have zero reliable Archaeological evidence for the T-Y, and only know from accounts that part of it was made of linen or leather, this is in no way inconsistent with the actual evidence. It may be inconsistant with what many believe, but that is not the same thing. But if there is something that directly contradicts this let me know, that's why I posted it. You and I do not believe Sekunda is correct for example, but frankly his scheme is the only one that has actual archaeological evidence behind it!

There is simply no reason to think that someone invented the idea of hiding plates inside an organic cuirass, just to get a little more protection out of it......why go to the effort of riveting 2 pieces together first??...

Why do we believe that the linothorax was quilted or layered? Largely because medieval armors were quilted and various armors from other cultures show how a proven and effective textile armor can be made in this manner. We have no evidence for it past some images that might show such patterns. And yet I believe this to be the truth based on analogy and functional design alone. For some reason you (you in the broad sense, not just Matt here) disregard analogy with the same cultures in this instance.

You can see in the image above that the coat of plates includes a portion for the upper chest almost exactly as big as this find that is riveted together. The upper chest need not be mobile, so no articulation in needed. As to why use pieces, obviously you can get away with using scraps, making smaller castings, or if using Iron, large plates might have been impossible early on. Again, why did they use them on the coat of plates?

As for "hiding" the metal, far too much is made of the showyness of bronze and far too little of the value of high quality linen or fine leather. Obviously any hoplite who sheathed his aspis in bronze could have covered his thorax in thin cosmetic plates if all he wanted to do is glint in the sunlight. We do not have a good grasp on the fashion trends of hoplites, but it is interesting that they move from Corinthian helmets, not to a simple scull cap, but to at least two forms of civilian head wear done up in bronze. I have never seen a satisfactory explanation for this- lightening the helmet does not explain why they used a civilian form. Was there a trasition where the actual felt cap was worn? I generally reject the arrows sticking in at Pylos arguement, but the transition needs explanation. The move between organic and metallic might be complex and not one way. Metal beneath organic is one option along such a path.