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Did only Centurions wear medals?
#16
Hi all,

I send some of the following pics again and some are new.
There are good examples for dona militariae by normal soldiers.
Ritchie Pogo
<a class="postlink" href="http://www.cohors-praetoria.eu">www.cohors-praetoria.eu
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#17
Where in the inscription does it state thete these two are regular legionaries and cavelry men?
I am having a hard time reading the inscription for Quintus Cornelius.
Visne partem mei capere? Comminus agamus! * Me semper rogo, Quid faceret Iulius Caesar? * Confidence is a good thing! Overconfidence is too much of a good thing.
[b]Legio XIIII GMV. (Q. Magivs)RMRS Remember Atuatuca! Vengence will be ours!
Titus Flavius Germanus
Batavian Coh I
Byron Angel
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#18
QC : MIL LEGXVI *MILES LEGIONIS XVI*

If he had another rank like imaginifer or officer there would have been a remark on the stone.

M.VIB.M.
Bushido wa watashi no shuukyou de gozaru.

Katte Kabuto no O wo shimeyo!

H.J.Vrielink.
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#19
OK, thanks. Yes it helps to look at the larger version of the file :roll: :lol:
What about the cavelry man, is there an inscription helpfully not shown in the photo?
Visne partem mei capere? Comminus agamus! * Me semper rogo, Quid faceret Iulius Caesar? * Confidence is a good thing! Overconfidence is too much of a good thing.
[b]Legio XIIII GMV. (Q. Magivs)RMRS Remember Atuatuca! Vengence will be ours!
Titus Flavius Germanus
Batavian Coh I
Byron Angel
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#20
While looking for something unrelated I stumbled across this:

Quote:And indeed it is the interest of the General that the most brave should also be the most fortunate, and that all should have medals and necklets to be proud of.

Juvenal, Satires, 16
David J. Cord
www.davidcord.com
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#21
Great quote! Thanks. Big Grin
"Fugit irreparabile tempus" (Irrecoverable time glides away) Virgil

Ron Andrea
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#22
Basically the same mind set as Ceasar! His word was good enough to convince me! :wink:
Visne partem mei capere? Comminus agamus! * Me semper rogo, Quid faceret Iulius Caesar? * Confidence is a good thing! Overconfidence is too much of a good thing.
[b]Legio XIIII GMV. (Q. Magivs)RMRS Remember Atuatuca! Vengence will be ours!
Titus Flavius Germanus
Batavian Coh I
Byron Angel
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#23
A brave soldier may have not gotten promoted to higher ranks due to a lack of the necessary administrative skills/command ability and therefore be a veteran soldier with with a lot of awards he could wear. Probably not on drill or fatigue duty but likely on special occasions and even on campaign. Some more valuable and/or difficult to wear awards may have
been sold and then possibly represented by Phalera much like modern ribbons are worn representing medals but until some evidence like a civic crown phalera is found it is speculation.
John Kaler MSG, USA Retired
Member Legio V (Tenn, USA)
Staff Member Ludus Militus https://www.facebook.com/groups/671041919589478/
Owner Vicus and Village: https://www.facebook.com/groups/361968853851510/
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#24
Quote:there is convincing evidence that the re-enactment conventions most of us seem to adhere to are dead wrong.

You may be dead right there! Nonetheless you do not appear to like the re-constructions of the Centurion Facilis kit in the Ancient Warfare Special because they do not adhere to the re-enactment conventions. However as there are in total four re-constructions of Facilis in my article alone, would you care to be more specific? :wink:

Jurjen, what was the source for your coloured pteryges? Do you have any first century AD examples?

Graham.
"Is all that we see or seem but a dream within a dream" Edgar Allan Poe.

"Every brush-stroke is torn from my body" The Rebel, Tony Hancock.

"..I sweated in that damn dirty armor....TWENTY YEARS!', Charlton Heston, The Warlord.
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#25
Quote:Jurjen, what was the source for your coloured pteryges? Do you have any first century AD examples?

Unfortunatelly, none. I made it based on my impression that pteryges could be also made of linen, not only leather. (compared with Linothorax, etc). Next based on the fact the Romans loved colours I wanted to do something with colours that should be 'dangerous' on first sight. Now, the next step in the design was some artwork in AW (yeah, how wrong can you be as to choose your source for such a thing) Igor Dzis, AW VOL III, issue 4. I like this combination of colours.

So, I think this doesn't help you much, but I'm quite interested in your opinion about the piece. I'm personally very pleased with the looks. Big Grin
________________________________________
Jvrjenivs Peregrinvs Magnvs / FEBRVARIVS
A.K.A. Jurjen Draaisma
CORBVLO and Fectio
ALA I BATAVORUM
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#26
Quote:You may be dead right there! Nonetheless you do not appear to like the re-constructions of the Centurion Facilis kit in the Ancient Warfare Special because they do not adhere to the re-enactment conventions. However as there are in total four re-constructions of Facilis in my article alone, would you care to be more specific? :wink:

Graham.

Yes Graham i will... Tongue

I am not convinced at all the material used for the reconstruction was correct. Imho mail would be the only military sane/valid armour for what we see on the centurios tombstone. Unless it was a dress item, the garment with the long shoulder doublings was either a hamata wrongly depicted by the stone mason, or a hamata of a type we do not know yet.

The protection the reconstruction as depicted in AWM would give on the field of battle comes nowhere near the protection an iron hamata would give,...

Just my two denarii... Tongue

M.VIB.M.
Bushido wa watashi no shuukyou de gozaru.

Katte Kabuto no O wo shimeyo!

H.J.Vrielink.
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#27
Quote:I am not convinced at all the material used for the reconstruction was correct. Imho mail would be the only military sane/valid armour for what we see on the centurios tombstone. Unless it was a dress item, the garment with the long shoulder doublings was either a hamata wrongly depicted by the stone mason, or a hamata of a type we do not know yet.

The protection the reconstruction as depicted in AWM would give on the field of battle comes nowhere near the protection an iron hamata would give,...

Myself. I would go for a type of hamata we do not know yet rather than blame the mason, who by all accounts appears to have been quite good and possibly attached to an army unit. Naturally I followed the discussion on the Greek pages about the thora-lino-spola or whatever it is called now and consensus seemed to agree on padded linen covered with a thin layer of leather as being quite acceptable as body protection and you have to admit that total agreement amongst RATers is practically unique! My article points out that the cuirass design itself, whatever its methods of construction, is rare and that over the years experts too have disagreed over many other points of the sculpture.

I totally agree with you that an iron hamata appears far superior to anything non metallic but then there have been many reasons and instances throughout history of soldiers not wearing what they should do, or not being issued with what they should have! Also I don't doubt for a minute that you yourself could lecture me on why what I view as that gross black lacquered stuff the Samurai wear, with floppy bits hanging all over it, is in fact technically and artistically far superior to the all encasing nice and neat shiny metal stuff the European knights wore! :wink: :wink:

Personally I am more interested in what people think of my belt reconstruction for Facilis. Although it is possible that a standard set of belt plates were enlarged for ease of sculpture this does not account in my view for the continual crenelated design. A design, which by the way appears on a number of other sculptures with or without the other interspersed motifs.

Jurjen, with regards to the coloured pteryges, there are examples of the blue and red coloured type on Etruscan period sculpture and your other reasoning appears sound. However unless some actual first century examples turn up you will not convince the doubters by quoting illustrators as evidence! :roll:

It would also be nice to see your subarmalis without the armour and apologies to everyone else for going off topic.

Graham.
"Is all that we see or seem but a dream within a dream" Edgar Allan Poe.

"Every brush-stroke is torn from my body" The Rebel, Tony Hancock.

"..I sweated in that damn dirty armor....TWENTY YEARS!', Charlton Heston, The Warlord.
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