The world\'s worst reenactor

[Doc]

Jeff,

That is really a nice pic. I do not have a group and cannot really get anyone interested where I am. So unfortunately I cannot take the nice picture that you did.

[jkaler48]

The reenactor is dressed in perfectly authentic in period costume. He is a Greek portraying a comic gay Tribune figure in a Roman stage farce. He will undoubtedly be whipped
and banished from Rome after the next performance.

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

OI!!! Lay off the Greeks....he's definately Celtiberian or some other barbarian race!!

"To give this debate a slightly different turn: I expected that our friends of XXX Ulpia would have intervened long time ago. This man, after all, is standing next to the Colosseum. That makes him some kind of ambassador of Rome. This is how the city wants to be seen. Now that is something I find deeply disturbing"

One of them attacked a Japanese tourist for not paying up recently. He was charged for assault!

[Jona Lendering]

What I think is worse, is that if he DID dress accurately compared to our current knowledge and archaeological evidence, would he still be recognized as a "Roman soldier"? We here in the U.S. have been called some interesting names, and when trying to politely correct them, still get some flak.

This is a very important point. On the one hand, a group of people needs something in common to recognize itself as a group. History often has the function of a foundation myth. In this way, the past is highly relevant. On the other hand, relevance is the enemy of history, which is -or should be- a subject of permanent debate. But what happens when the canon clashes with new insights?

Unfortunately, there are vested interests. I was shocked by some recent criticism and scorn when I said that we did not owe western democracy to the ancient Greeks, because I thought that by 2010, people would know more about the medieval roots of the system. Then I discovered that the people criticizing me, were classicists, afraid of their jobs; so they willingly tell stories they know are not true. Another example: Islamic influence on western universities is also unacceptable for many people - for obvious reasons, these days. So here's a legitimate subject of debate, but the debate can get tainted.

As far as I am concerned, I think that when the canon clashes with new insights, the latter must always prevail. Only then, people will realize that the past is always in flux, and that politicians and political activists cannot base their claims on historical antecedents. When people say "the past has taught us...", we should no longer listen.

In fact the city made a law a few years ago, which said that only "Romans" certified by the city are allowed to stand there now. When did you take the pic?

Two weeks ago.

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

So what do we owe wester democracy to Jona? :?
I don't recall much from my limited knowledge of the medieval period that would make me think of the medieval fuedal system as democratic!
I am a little puzzled by some elements of society who seem to be keen on removing any debt or trace of a link to ancient Greece, and Athenian Democracy. I am totally facinated as to whom we actually owe the idea to?
I understood the medieval period owed its grasp of the idea directly to their knowledge of the ancient greeks. Not that they were the originators. I would find any theory that they invented the idea wit hno influence to the Greeks as re-writing history, with all due respect.

[caiusbeerquitius]

Two weeks ago.

Maybe he was BREAKIN´ THE LAW :mrgreen:

[Jona Lendering]

I am totally facinated as to whom we actually owe the idea to?

The Estates General; plus Marsilio Mainardini's Defensor Pacis (1325), which continues the idea of the "double truth" from Ibn Rushd. Here, we see the core ideas of European democracy for the first time: separation of powers, separation of church and state, representation. From here, we move on to the Calvinist ideas of the sixteenth century, to the rise of parliamentarian power, to Montesquieu's Esprit des lois, and ultimately to the European Revolutions: 1776 USA, 1785 Holland, 1789 France, and so on. They all looked back to acts and declarations that broke with Feudalism and gave power to the Estates. No one refers to Greece. It is only in the course of the nineteenth century, when Philhellenism became popular, that people started to realize that the system that had been created over the past centuries, might be labeled "democracy".

We must separate "take inspiration from" (something active) from "be influenced by" (something more powerful than oneself). Artists have taken inspiration from Greece, but western political thought was not influenced by ancient Greece.

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

And there I was thinking it was about giving more than a minority of people the right to have a say in affairs of the state.... :roll:

So these great thinkers had no influence from the Ancient literature that I am sure they would have had exclusive access to?
Was it not the American colonists who decided to divorce the state and the church. English parlimentarians such as Cromwell had a hard time seperating themselves from some divine calling I recall. :?

[kevair464]

I don't know if anyone else noticed, but is he wearing a navy blue zip up fleece sweat shirt underneath the "armor"? If you look at the neck you can see the zipper, and the sleeves very much look like a sweatshirt.......just an observation........oh and I am thinking about selling off my kit to get something more recognized by most people here in the states as a "roman soldier"

THIS.......IS.....ROMAAAA!!!

Now to work on the abs

[jkaler48]

My new impression is better uh I mean more worser

[jkaler48]

Another tourist robber in Rome that charges 10 euros per photo!

[P Sertorius Scaevola]

Say Marcus, just who in your photo would you like to present as the World's Worst Re-enactor?

[D B Campbell]

This thread is clearly getting too serious for Off Topic. So I should like to point out that Jona's re-enactor is quite clearly Ricky Gervais, filming "The Officium" (? should that be Tabularium ?):
[attachment=0:1y1sbuq6]<!-- ia0 ricky-gervais-observer-magazine.jpg<!-- ia0 [/attachment:1y1sbuq6]

[P. Clodius Secundus]

.... 1776 USA, 1785 Holland, 1789 France, and so on. They all looked back to acts and declarations that broke with Feudalism and gave power to the Estates. No one refers to Greece. It is only in the course of the nineteenth century, when Philhellenism became popular, that people started to realize that the system that had been created over the past centuries, might be labeled "democracy".

We must separate "take inspiration from" (something active) from "be influenced by" (something more powerful than oneself). Artists have taken inspiration from Greece, but western political thought was not influenced by ancient Greece.

If you consider Revolution to be overthrowing an existing political structure by threat or violence and replacing it with a significantly different (ad hoc/improvised or not) system, then the American Revolution actually began in 1774. It occurred in the towns and counties surrounding The city of Boston. Enraged by the Crown's punitive measures, armed bands of militia forced the closure of the courts and mobs forced the King's representatives to recant their offices. By the time of Lexington and Concord and the "shot heard round the world" (April 1775) there were virtually no civil or military authorities remaining outside Boston proper. The interim government they formed closely resembled the town-hall model which remoteness and their revoked charters had accustomed them.
I am actually waiting for delivery of a book on the subject. Now, thanks to everyone's comments I will be sure to look for evidence of the motivations, inspirations, and influences of the participants when I read it.

[MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS]

there are more....