The AD33 crucifixion detail in Judea

[Evert]

To pass on the passion play and religious canon:
There is the theory that the death of Julius Caesar inspired the cruxifiction epos, by Francesco Carotta:

Gospel of caesar

DIVVS IVLIVS site

[M. Demetrius]

You gotta be kidding me, Evert.

[Evert]

It's a theory, nothing more.
Some arguments are far fetched but the total seems overwhelming. It does require some 'out-of-the bible-thinking' though.
The Caesar devotion woven into Christianity is not that strange if you consider the other elements that got woven into it.
I'm not saying Jesus = Caesar, I'm saying the biblical cruxifiction epos of Jesus is inspired/contains elements that sync with the historical death tale of Caesar.
Check this link for the complete story.

Now, lets focus again on a generic cruxifiction in Judea around 33 AD.

[D B Campbell]

Some arguments are far fetched but the total seems overwhelming.

Hmmm, I came across this "theory" several years ago, when it appeared (to me, at any rate) as a bandwagon of "scientists" with a vested interest (e.g. there seems to be an associated production line of publications, both print and film). I have never seen an academic peer review, which speaks volumes. :roll:

[M. Demetrius]

Well, I have a theory that Julius Caesar was really the reincarnation of Alexander the Great, who was really the reincarnation of Rog the Neanderthal Destroyer. Evidence? Don't need any. I'll just hold to the theory, and can come up with a cover story when needed.

[caiusbeerquitius]

I have a theory that (enter generic holy man or supernatural thingy of your taste) was really a divine being. Evidence? Don't need any. I'll just hold to the theory, and can come up with a cover story when needed. ;-)

=> That´s what most religions do, methinks. :roll:

[MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS]

It is obvious that Jesus was an alien.

To be serious, the vinegar in which the spunge (whatever kind it was) was soaked was higly likely the Roman "military" refreshment drink called Posca. It would have been there for the soldiers to drink and refresh themselves since waiting for about 12 ot more hours in the Judaean blazing sun is no sinecure.

M.VIB.M.

[Vincula]

There is the theory that the death of Julius Caesar inspired the cruxifiction epos, by Francesco Carotta:
Gospel of caesar

it is mentioned in my favorite blog: http://antoninuspius.blogspot.com/

[MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS]

Ah, mister M. Oron.

Quite the scientist...

[Crispvs]

Ah - Mr Carotta - obviously a wiser man than me. I could not possibly have worked out with such precision the important reality that Jesus Christ never existed and was in fact made up as an allegory of Julius Caesar. I thought I was being so clever in relying on such shaky and unreliable evidence as (and I shall list them to demonstrate my ignorance)

Suetonius - Caesar LXXXIV
Plutarch - Caesar (sorry - I don't have the exact reference to hand)
Josephus - JA 18, 63-64
Tacitus - Annales XV
Mark 15 20-46
Matthew 27 22-56
Luke 23 21-53
John 18 6-41

And, speaking of Antoninus Pius, there is of course that mysterious document 'The Acts of Pilate' (no, not the fifth century AD forgery) quoted in AD155 to the said emperor by Justin the Martyr.
http://www.livius.org/pi-pm/pilate/pilat...ml#Diverse


Incidentally, to return to a topic more relevant to the original point of this thread, when I play the part of centurion in the 'Christ in the Centre' passion play in Leicester each year, I instruct any soldiers not actively involved in crucifying the three actors playing Christ and the two thieves to watch the crowd as if they were watching for zealots hidden amongst it armed with knives or slings who might be looking to score a blow for their cause by killing or injuring a Roman soldier in a public place, even if it meant sacrificing themselves.

Personally, I think security was probably an issue on the day. After all there had been numerous uprisings in the past, some within living memory, almost certainly aided by a popular longing for the Messiah to come and free the Jews from first Seleucid and then Roman rule. Jesus had been called the Messiah and even if no fault had been found in Him by Pilate, the execution of a man seen by the public as the Messiah might well attract unwanted trouble. The Romans must have been well aware that He had been attracting large crowds of followers and I am sure that there must have been more than just four soldiers there. After all, why would a centurion need to be present to supervise only four men - or eight for that matter? If only four men were required to crucify the three men, then the aforementioned Occam's razor would suggest that the rest of the soldiers under the centurion's command were there for security reasons.


Crispvs

[Charlie]

Totally agree with you Crispvs.
I have been illustrating Biblical themes for some time now, and hopefully this year I will get to paint the scene depicting the Centurion from Mark 15:39. A powerful text indeed!
I to believe that security would have been utmost on Pilate's and the soldiers minds, as this was certainly no ordinary crucifixion....Pilate new this undoubtedly. His life was never the same again after his encounter with Christ.
Like Crispvs mentioned, why was a Centurion needed if there was no concern of an uprising or trouble?

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

There was always a problem with uprisings in Judea, so it was probably pretty standard for all executions and crucifictions.

[Charlie]

Maybe so Byron, but it was a first for someone claiming to be the 'King of the Jews' and having many follwers. Again this was no ordinary exucution, and both Jewish and Roman leaders new this.

[Ghostmojo]

Nisus Wettus: "Next. Crucifixion?"

Prisoner #1: "Yes."

Nisus Wettus: "Good. Out of the door. Line on the left. One cross each. Next. Crucifixion?"

Prisoner #2: "Yes."

Nisus Wettus: "Good. Out of the door. Line on the left. One cross each. Next. Crucifixion?"

Mr. Cheeky: "Ah, no. Freedom."

Nisus Wettus: "What?"

Mr. Cheeky: "Eh, freedom for me. They said I hadn't done anything, so I can go free and live on an island somewhere."

Nisus Wettus: "Oh, oh that´s jolly good well. Off you go then."

Mr. Cheeky: "No, I'm only pulling your leg, it's crucifixion really!"

Nisus Wettus: "Oh, I see, very good. Well..." :lol:

Mr. Cheeky: "Yes I know, out the door, one cross each, line on the left." :wink:


Sorry. I just couldn't resist! :grin: I've been reading this thread for a while and my restraint has finally collapsed :lol:

What?!!! You want more? Well OK - let's finish it off then:


Nisus Wettus: "Mhmm. Crucifixion party. 'Morning. Now, we will be on a show as we go through the town, so let's not let the side down. Keep in a good, straight line, three lengths between you and the man in front, and a good, steady pace. Crosses over your left shoulders, and, if you keep your backs hard up against the crossbeam,..."

Alfonso: "Ohhh."

Nisus Wettus: ...you'll be there in no time.

Alfonso: "Ohhh."

Nisus Wettus: "Heh."

Alfonso: "Ooh."

Nisus Wettus: "All right, Centurion."

Centurion Parvus: "Crucifixion party! Wait for it."

Alfonso: "Ooh."

Centurion Parvus: "Crucifixion party, by the left! Forward!"

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

But was he claiming to be king of the Jews?
Was that not a title given him by others?
As Crispus mentioned, there were frequent proclamations of a new messiah,
and Judea was constantly in termoil, rebelion fermenting.