Auxilia Standard Bearers

[Folkert van Wijk]

Sinds I made myself a standard link from old RAT
I would look a little more into how a Auxilia Standard Bearer would look 1 and 2 ad... (more or less 8) )

But because I do have only one (old)book with a drawing of an Aux signifier i would like to know if this drawing is still considered up to date and good to go by...?

Do they indeed use smaller shields like the parma or like the the one from the guy on the left that I am focusing at...?

the book I have this drawing from is Warfare in the Classical World from John Warry

[Peroni]

Hi Folkert,

The standard bearer on the left is based on a Third Century tombstone from Brocolitia/Carrawburgh (Base of COH I Batavorum) On the stone he appears unarmoured and wearing a ring-buckle belt. In your drawing he has been depicted incorrectly as a First Century standard bearer. It is unclear whether the sculptor is trying to show a curvature or if it is just a very strange shield shape!

Trajan's Column shows some auxiliary standard bearers carrying the small round shield. IIRC this is the first time we see standard bearers with small round parmae)The auxiliary standard bearers shown on the Tropaeum Traiani at Adamklissi have no armour, helmets or shields!

Also see the imagebase for the tombstones of Pintaeus of the 5th Asturians and Genialis of the 7th Raetians..
http://www.romanarmy.com/cms/component/ ... Itemid,94/ No shield
http://www.romanarmy.com/cms/component/ ... Itemid,94/ No shield

Here is the Carrawburgh stele (The Clayton Museum - Chesters Fort, Chollerford, Northumberland)


Trajan's Column...

[Folkert van Wijk]

Thanks Adrian,

So I have to reconsidder... hm... :roll: :|

[Paullus Scipio]

Peroni wrote:

The standard bearer on the left is based on a Third Century tombstone from Brocolitia/Carrawburgh (Base of COH I Batavorum) On the stone he appears unarmoured and wearing a ring-buckle belt. In your drawing he has been depicted incorrectly as a First Century standard bearer. It is unclear whether the sculptor is trying to show a curvature or if it is just a very strange shield shape!

Trajan's Column shows some auxiliary standard bearers carrying the small round shield. IIRC this is the first time we see standard bearers with small round parmae)The auxiliary standard bearers shown on the Tropaeum Traiani at Adamklissi have no armour, helmets or shields!

Also see the imagebase for the tombstones of Pintaeus of the 5th Asturians and Genialis of the 7th Raetians..
http://www.romanarmy.com/cms/component/ ... Itemid,94/ No shield
http://www.romanarmy.com/cms/component/ ... Itemid,94/ No shield

As the originator of those figures in Warry, I should perhaps comment. As with so many things about the Roman Military, little is known about the Standard Bearers of any particular era. When I visited the Chesters fort Museum in the mid-1970's and looked at that relief, it seemed to me that scales were faintly, but clearly visible ( not evident in Peroni's photo, but evident in other published photos of this piece ), and I was advised the piece dated to "late Second/early Third Century A.D ". Because every word in the caption box was at a premium, I briefly described the figures as "Ist-2nd Centuries AD", rather than "1st-late 2nd, / early Third Century AD" (N.B. not "1st Century AD")- being a general interest book, there was no need to be that specific.
The right hand figure Folkert reproduced is based on Pintaeus, and a clearly depicted standard.The middle figure is a legionary Standard Bearer based on Trajan's column. As I suggested earlier in Phil Barker's "Armies and Enemies of Imperial Rome(revised fourth edition)" ,there is evidence to suggest, at least in the first Century through Trajan's column and down to the end of the Second century/early Third of the Carrowburgh relief that Praetorian standard bearers wore Lion skins with 'mask', Legionary Standard Bearers wore Bearskin with 'mask' and Auxiliary Standard Bearers wore Bearskin with the 'mask' cut away, though this is not entirely certain becacause many of the stelae, friezes etc are damaged and hence open to interpretation, but does seem likely.
We have discussed this subject in detail at least once before here on RAT.
As to the Standard Bearers on the Adamklissi Tropaeum, they are not in 'battle' scenes, hence not shown in 'battle dress', but rather in a series of peaceful scenes, hence likely shown in 'undress uniform'.

[Folkert van Wijk]

Thanks to booth and yes, surching seurching "auxilia standard bearer" reveels you guys have crossed gladii before on this subject. :wink:

Natuurly my impression will be something even more like a mixture of a "Celtic" and "Roman" auxilia standard bearer...
...so if i find myswelf a bear skin with a flat fase for less than 200 euro, I would be stupid not no buy it?

[Peroni]

I would be stupid not no buy it?

For less than 200 Euros - yes!

[Marcus Iulius Chattus]

For less than 200€, i would buy 3 skins, because you get them in Germany only for much more money, around 1000€......

BTW, a really nice Boar-Standart, Folkert

[Peroni]

Exactly! My bear pelt cost me £400.00 and that was CHEAP!

[Paullus Scipio]

Lovely impression Adrian, as I am sure people have noted before....and this photo demonstrates why it is hard to see if the 'mask' of the animal is intact or cut away ! If it is difficult in a photo, how much more difficult on a damaged stelae ? :? ?

[Folkert van Wijk]

Ah just noticed 1 little detail... or 4 to be exactly. My pelt will be without the claws and feet... :x

[Marcus Mummius]

Ah just noticed 1 little detail... or 4 to be exactly. My pelt will be without the claws and feet... :x

Ouch, that's too bad.

Perhaps you can find another cheap skin that has the feet and transplant them. That's not too difficult to do.

[Peroni]

and this photo demonstrates why it is hard to see if the 'mask' of the animal is intact or cut away ! If it is difficult in a photo, how much more difficult on a damaged stelae ?

Yes Paul, quite so. The head/face on the Pintaeus stele could be interpreted as the muzzle/nose of the pelt folded upwards.

I have a wolf pelt too, but that has no muzzle, It got damaged, but it starts just in front of the eye sockets. But, still looks good without it.

Perhaps you can find another cheap skin that has the feet and transplant them. That's not too difficult to do.

Like the evil Dr. Frankenstein :twisted: -[size=85:3r63gizd] hmmm platypus head on squirrell with a fish tail and lions feet.....[/size]

[Folkert van Wijk]

Like the evil Dr. Frankenstein :twisted: -[size=85:3165zrpo] hmmm platypus head on squirrell with a fish tail and lions feet.....[/size]

A well Celts did like shape-shifting images so why not... :mrgreen: 8)

[LUCIUS ALFENUS AVITIANUS]

In some internet sites you can buy real or plastic bear skulls. So you have to buy one of these and fix over your bear skin.

For exemple:
http://www.connecticutvalleybiological. ... _1217.html

[M. CVRIVS ALEXANDER]

Purchasing a real bear skull might be actually less expensive and, certainly, more authentic. I bought mine at http://www.hideandfur.com/ for less than $50 (they have good prices for bear pelts as well - mine was $350, and the fur is gorgeous). I only used the upper part which was shaped to fit on the top of the helmet, but buying the whole skull was inexpensive anyway.