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Chiton - brain picking corner
#1
I'm an old hand when it comes to reenactment, but totally new to the world of Romans (and new to this Forum). I've been asked if I would like to attend a Roman event locally to me and being a total anorak when it comes to authenticity I would like to make myself a proper Chiton as an undergarment. I need to pick your brains as you all seem to know your subjects 8)

Firstly, what was the main chosen fabric for this - Linen? Wool? Both??
Colours - was there a particular rule or did people wear what they fancied at the time or followed fashion?
Now for the mysterious buttons on the shoulders (see images below) - What were they? Wood? Other? I just can't seem to find any references to these. Archaeologically they are also not mentioned that I could see, which made me wonder if only women of a certain rank wore them, or if they were made from perishable materials that wouldn't survive in the ground/cremations.

Lastly, for shoulder brooches for the Peplos - once again did women wear what they fancied/was in fashion or did that too have hard and fast rules?

All comments appreciated Big Grin

[Image: sleeves.jpg]
[Image: livia_clothing3.jpg]
Si hoc signum legere potes, operis boni in rebus Latinis alacribus et fructuosis potiri potes!
Nemo saltat sorbius, nisi infanus est.
Postumia Agrippina - Marika.
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#2
Ave!

Hoo, not a simple topic--and this thread might get kicked over to the Civilian section. First, chiton and peplos are Greek words, not Latin. The first Roman garment you show is a tunica, in the style we cleverly call "gap-sleeved". It is VERY wide, reaching as far as your wrists when unbelted. We have NO IDEA what those blasted buttons are! Exactly none have ever been reported as finds, that I've ever heard of. In fact, in some illustrations they just look like little tufts of fabric that have been pulled up and maybe tied around their bases with thread. But I'd say that wood or horn are "safe", while bronze or silver or gold are not out of the question.

The peplos is a Greek garment characterized by the way the top is folded down like a large flap. It dates to the Archaic and Classical era, call it 500 BC. By the time of the late Republic or early Empire, it apparently shows up in Roman artwork only on goddesses. So I would steer clear of it for basic Roman civilian clothing. (Too bad, cuz it's a really cool dress!)

Wool was far and away the common fabric, but linen was also used, and a blessing in hot weather for modern people!

Every time I get into a discussion of Roman women's clothing, I have to try to remember what I've learned, or run to the bookshelf and try to relearn it... Best bet is "The World of Roman Costume" by Sebesta and Bonfante, and "Roman Clothing and Fashion" by AT Croom. Great books!

But as I recall, women generally wore a sleeveless or shortsleeved plain undertunic, and/or a gap-sleeved tunic, and/or a stola on top. *I* believe the stola may have had a narrowish rectangular body and a long *vertical* neckslit gathered at the shoulders into narrow bands. It was clearly a garment which was distinctive in some way to the Romans, but of course they didn't bother putting handy labels on their artwork... It was also the garment of the Roman matron, so if you're not married or a motherly type, skip it and stick with a tunica! When out in public, everything was mostly covered by the palla, a very large rectangular wrap of wool, and part of it was draped over the head (if you are a *decent* woman!).

Of course, once you get out the frontiers, all kinds of barbarian fashions start mixing in!

EVERYthing about clothing was driven by rather strict fashions. Sure, you could do your own thing within those guidelines, but clothing was a language in the ancient world, and if your clothes screamed "I am a wacky person who has to be significantly different just because!", you'd probably be shunned, banished, or burned. Our problem today is trying to figure out exactly what those fashions were, of course, and too much of our evidence is ambiguous or even contradictory.

Have I helped, or made it impossible?? Good luck and Vale,

Matthew
Matthew Amt (Quintus)
Legio XX, USA
<a class="postlink" href="http://www.larp.com/legioxx/">http://www.larp.com/legioxx/
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#3
Ave!

And thank you! Out of the 47 people (at time of writing this) having read this question, only you have responded so far, and a very good one it is too. You have given me food for thought and some nice book references to get started on too :lol:

I guess those 'buttons' will continue to cause bafflement till someone either finds a superb archaeological example or works out that a particular common object in various museums around the world are, in fact, those mysterious buttons.

Thank you and good luck in continuing your research :mrgreen:
Si hoc signum legere potes, operis boni in rebus Latinis alacribus et fructuosis potiri potes!
Nemo saltat sorbius, nisi infanus est.
Postumia Agrippina - Marika.
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#4
That top picture seems to show a wealthy woman, and wealthy women did also fancy silks, just look at that picture how the fabric falls, that is too fine for linen, that looks more like a very fine silk fabric. Although as far as I remember, wearing silk garments in public was thought to be a bit scandelous by common roman standards. If you where able to read German, a good read would be the book "Kleidung und Schmuck in Rom und den Provinzen" by Astrid Böhme-Schönberger as that book gives a good run over what was woren in rom and in the provinces.
Martin J.
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#5
Thank you Martin, I shall look up that book as I can read and speak German (and Dutch) too. Vielen Dank! Big Grin

Edit: Looks like an excellent book, but sadly no one currently has one available Sad
Si hoc signum legere potes, operis boni in rebus Latinis alacribus et fructuosis potiri potes!
Nemo saltat sorbius, nisi infanus est.
Postumia Agrippina - Marika.
Reply
#6
Hmm have you had a look at emule? I had justed checked sites like zvab but unfortunately no results.... :?
If you can not find it anywhere at all, well if you gave me your email addresse I could scan my copy and send it to you.
As it is not a big book with 120 pages.

Edit: You might be able to get that book here:
http://www.google.de/url?sa=t&source=we ... iA&cad=rja

I did not think that this book would be out of print so soon :?
Martin J.
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