Quote:NOW I am interested in simulating this. This is an occurrence, not a norm. That is, it may occur in quite a few battles, but it is a DEVELOPMENT form the earlier pushing/fighting stage that takes over as a mechanic int he thickest part of the fight. Is that a fair statement? Perhaps I'm just dense, but I see this better now.
The fault is mine, for it is very difficult to convey properly. That said, yes you have the essence of it. In fact the earlier type of pushing, rushing, shield-butting, that you refer to is probably common in all clashes of line infantry on occaision. Sometimes the men in back start piling on and pushing even in these other non-hoplite clashes, but the system breaks down as your own men cannot take the pressure and start pushing back at you- leading to chaos. The rason that I consistantly tie the othismos to the aspis is that whether it was specifically designed to do this, or the shape had another function early on, it has the capability of allowing you to survive the pressures within a crowd such as this, thus the rear rankers can effectively add their pushing force.
It is something that developed over time in the history of hoplite battle, but it is also something that develops over the course of a battle. Unlike the current orthodox, where men crash from the charge into what they term othismos, my version takes some time to develop as ranks pile up. While this is going on spear fencing dominates.
It also must go in cycles within a battle, with both "crowds" reacting to each other by loosening and tightening. The whole battle-line need not do this at once either. Also, because it is not the initial stage of battle it may never form. Both sides have to be willing to engage in it or be unable to back up out of it in order for it to take place. That said, you can see the downside to back-pedaling in the face of an enemy phalanx.
Because the greeks have this term "othismos" for when battles "come to pushing", I am assuming that if my model is correct, then othismos means this crowd-like crash. To them the term might have been much more expansive, including the type of local, less crowd-like pushing that I would call proto-othismos (for surely such things preceeded othismos both in development and in the course of battle). There are so many aspects of this that I cannot predict without seeing it done. The whole field of crowd-mechanics is pretty new, and no one has ever asked how a crowd would MAXIMIZE the killing force! It took some time, military topics are not always popular in academia, but I think I've gotten some true experts interested int he concept.
Quote:A condition can occur where, after phalanxes have approached one another unpacked and impacted, they compact into a dense, standing formation where the massed groups heave against one another.
Yes, it is simply the result of additional ranks piling up behind the first two facing each other. As the ranks pile up they essentially become a "crowd" of men. Unless they stand as I describe, they can never generate more pushing force than that which can be produced by the first few ranks, since additional force is not transferred effectively, but simply absorbed by your own men. Note that the rear rank men need not stand straight up because they don't have the force of weight pushing them into this position and need not transfer any force from behind them. They would help steady the men in the file in front from being knocked back.
Thanks to both of you. This is my third, and I am finding I can enjoy him without the constant sense of panic the first two engendered.
Paul M. Bardunias
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A Spartan, being asked a question, answered "No." And when the questioner said, "You lie," the Spartan said, "You see, then, that it is stupid of you to ask questions to which you already know the answer!"
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