Basic kit for 5th century infantry?

[panairjdde]

Hello.

I would like to start with a very basic kit for a 5th century infantry "tiro" (is that word used even in the 5th century?).

What I need? Where should I start looking for informations? Which part of the equipment I should try to make myself and which I should expect to buy?

Best regards

[jvrjenivs]

Start with a tunic, shoes and probably trousers (which part of the late roman empire do you want to show?). There has been written a lot on this subject here on RAT already.

Also, Robert Vermaat has a lot of info on his website:
[url:jbdt50or]http://www.fectio.org.uk/fectio.htm[/url]

[LUCIUS ALFENUS AVITIANUS]

Add an spear and a shield, and some kind of belt. Then a knife or sax. A sword, armour and helmet are expected only if you want to recreate a wealthier warrior.

[Robert Vermaat]

I would like to start with a very basic kit for a 5th century infantry "tiro" (is that word used even in the 5th century?).

What I need? Where should I start looking for informations? Which part of the equipment I should try to make myself and which I should expect to buy?

Roman? Non-Roman?

Make yourself:
Tunic (easy!).
Belt (simple, sometimes even modern ones can be adapted easily).
Spearshaft.
Shield.

Trousers are a bit in-between. making them yourself is possible of course, but if you can ask someone it's better than buy them, But Thorsberg trousers are sold, too.

Buy:
Spearhead.
Shoes (better that way).
Shoeld boss.

[panairjdde]

Ok, I try to be more clear: I'd like to reenact a Roman soldier of the western half army, roughly at the half of the 5th century. My avatar, Majorian, should be a hint ; my target (very far in the future) should be a Roman soldier from his campaign against the Visigoths (year 458).

As regards the tunic, I read here on the forum that they were in linen or in wool (thin wool), right? Should it be decorated? Where I can study/read about the shapes and patterns of the tunic?

Also, if trousers should be included, what model/colour/fabric? Where might I look for informations on belts of that period? Finally, as regards boots, I looked on some on-line reenactment shops, but the later models belong to the 3rd century, so I wonder what kind of boots the used in the 5th century (and where I can buy them).

Sorry for the many questions, any reference for self-education is welcome.

[Caballo]

Well, here are some original pictures from that timeframe that may give you some ideas?

[John Conyard]

Hi,

In no way trying to belittle Robert's solo efforts, let me recomend www.comitatus.net This site holds a mass of information including kit guides and suplliers which should help you out. We currently have lots of new recruits going through the same process as yourself, getting their kit together for next season.

Currently the site is moving servers but should be back up ASAP. If you send me a PM with your email address I can try to email you some information directly.

Currently we have tunics, belts and iron work leaving our "factories" faster than presents from Santa's grotto. I expect some will even be for Santa's Grotto.

[FAVENTIANVS]

The tunic better with square segmenta instead of round orbuculi.

Check www.armamentaria.com belt components, at a very good price.

[FAVENTIANVS]

A narrow belt is also distinctive... :wink:

[panairjdde]

Thank you all for your informations.

I understand that in the 5th century the dercorations were figurative, rather than geometric, and with squares even on the lower front, right?

Best regards.

[Theodosius the Great]

Ave,

Here are two relevant threads from the Market Place:

• Looking to buy Late Roman tunic
  
  
• Wanted: 5th Cent. Western Roman Civ+Mil Kit Items+Suppliers

I understand that in the 5th century the dercorations were figurative, rather than geometric, and with squares even on the lower front, right?

Based on what I read, I would say figurative decorations become more common but do not completely supercede geometric designs. The two types were still worn concurrently. I know of a sixth century tunic will all geometric clavii patterns.

Claire Marshall from www.comitatus.net makes excellent tunics with figurative squares, BTW.

For shoes / boots I think the only option is to have a shoe maker custom-make you a pair. Find a pattern and show it to him.

Good luck.

~Theo

[panairjdde]

I have started studing the tunic. I found the informations on comitatus' page (it is very useful) and I am checking some pictures about Coptic textiles.

One thing I am not sure I understood is the width of the tunic. I have been reading that for military male tunics the tunic body is as wide as the elbows. I mean, if the tunic is a capital 'T', the vertical stroke should go from elbow to elbow, with the horizontal stroke extending from the elbows to the hands, right? However it looks like very wide, with the sleeves starting at the elbows, quite uncomfortable, I think. Furthermore, in most pictures, such as the standard-bearer and the unarmoured infantryman at [urll1ylahm]http://www.comitatus.net/trooptypes.htm[/url], the sleeves seem to start closer to the armpits. Am I wrong?

Best regards.

[John Conyard]

Good evening,

I think that mail armour and belts combine to make these tunics look as if they fit the body closer than they actually do. Certainly the standard bearer has a very nice wide tunic. He got married in it.

However there is also a tendency amongst modern people to reconstruct items in such a way as to please modern sensibilities. So tunics become tailored to the body. Hairstyles become modern. And although there are some finds of plain wooden scabbards, I like the look of oiled wood so will choose it out of preference to a leather covered scabbard. More scabbards were leather covered, and I should chose one to represent the norm. But wood just looks good, so I have a couple of relatively plain wooden scabbards done in ash.

I suspect Roman tunics were wide for lots of reasons. Looms were large. And it was their fashion. And because tunics help act as padding under armour. And because you can bring your arms inside the body of the tunic for extra warmth whilst sleeping.

However barbarian tunics from the period do seem to hug the body much closer than Roman tunics.

I'm glad you found the website useful.

[TFLAVIUSAMBIORIX]

By the second half of the 5th century we also see some fashionable people beginning to wear layers. Ive seen some depictions of a tighter under tunic with a baggier half sleeved overtunic.

I will attempt to find the book and scan the images, it is one in french on the late roman and Byzantine empire. it also has an intriguing scene from the beginning of the 7th century that shows one soldier still wearing a plain short sleeved tunic, which I guess may have survived amongst the lower classes in ome way, or may just be an artistic convention though the others wear long sleeved tunics in it.

[MarcellusCCLXXV]

Ave!

I have begun putting together a Late Roman period kit myself. Let me share with you how I have gone about it thus far.

The first step you should take is research. There are some very fine, written materials out there, written by Late Roman reenactors on line, and also by various academic researchers and authors. For example, the Ospery series of books are very good, like the Late Roman Infantryman, 236-566 AD. Another excellent source is The Last Legionary: Life as a Roman Soldier AD400, by Paul Elliott.

To-date, I have purchased a Spangenhelm (helmet), Plumbata (missile dart) and Spatha (Sword). I have made a shield, Pannonian cap and a Draco. What I have found is that some items can be purchased, but some items can be made.

Assuming you are hoping to replicate a Late Roman heavy infantryman, here is the full kit you might want: Spangenhelm, Plumatae, Spatha, Lance (lance), tunic (with clavi and orbiculi), trousers, cloak with crossbow clasp, greaves, shield, balteus (sword strap), belt, military ankle boots, neck guard (scarf), Pannonian cap, and Lorica Hamata or Lorica Squamata (chain mail armor or scale armor).

Understand that the above is for a full, heavy infantryman kit. You can get away with a lot less if you opt for a "light" infantryman kit.

Oh, another suugestion I have is to look on line at photos of other Late Roman reenactors. Many of the kits are quite good, and will give you a visual reference as to what kind of historical authenticity to pursue.

Good luck! Marcellus Valerias Gothicus (aka Dave Dietrich)