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I have just read (although i think i already knew) that there were about twenty gladiator helmets found at pompeii/herculaneum- several of which were secutor helmets. Try as I might i can only find two of the latter-and then with that frustrating problem of not being able to get an all round view.
So
Is there a database on RAT ??( i have not found it thus far if it exists)
or any where else for that matter??
Hopefully somebody knows, :?
Frustrated
Richard Robinson
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Richard,
No there isn’t any. The gladiatorial helmets aren’t included in the helmet database.
The best place to start would be Junkelmann’s new edition of Gladiatoren: Das Spiel mit dem Tod. It contains a catalogue of original gladiatorial armour including the description of 36 (partial) helmets.
Best regards,
Martijn
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If there were to be such a database, I would love to see a picture of the murmillo helm that used to be on display in the Castel s. Angelo. It was there when I first visited Rome in 1968. It was no longer on display when I next visited in '71. I was beginning to think that I had imagined it but Junkelmann mentions it in "Das Spiel mit dem Tod," but without a picture. I asked him about it and he said he'd been unable to get a photo of it. I remember that it lacked a visor but back then I didn't know the signs to look for to see if it had ever had a visor, or cheekplates. I believe it is the only surviving gladiator extant that I don't have a picture of, though there may be some lurking in private collections.
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Quote: I would love to see a picture of the murmillo helm that used to be on display in the Castel s. Angelo.
John
Can you please expand on this .... give an idea of era and style etc ??
Cheers
Conal Moran
Do or do not, there is no try!
Yoda
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As I recall (this was 40 years ago and I wasn't very knowledgeable) it was a brimmed helmet of the Pompeii era. It had a crest but I don't remember if it was curved or angular. I'm pretty sure that it had embossed decoration. It was displayed under glass on its own pedestal. That's about it.
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There's a murmillo helmet at the Pompeii exhibit at the National Gallery of Art in DC. Okay, I should say that it is labeled as a thrax but it's got a smooth crest with scenes of the Trojan War on it so I seriously doubt it's a thrax.
Their website doesn't have a picture but you can see part of it in the Children's Guide on page 10. Yes, I know all the info on the helmet is dead wrong too. Grrrr!!!
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Deb
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Quote:If there were to be such a database, I would love to see a picture of the murmillo helm that used to be on display in the Castel s. Angelo. It was there when I first visited Rome in 1968. It was no longer on display when I next visited in '71. I was beginning to think that I had imagined it but Junkelmann mentions it in "Das Spiel mit dem Tod," but without a picture. I asked him about it and he said he'd been unable to get a photo of it. I remember that it lacked a visor but back then I didn't know the signs to look for to see if it had ever had a visor, or cheekplates. I believe it is the only surviving gladiator extant that I don't have a picture of, though there may be some lurking in private collections.
Jhon, I was in castel Sant' Angelo some months ago , and the helmet wasn' t there.
But I live in Rome, and a friend of mine works for Vatican State as restorer. If you want , I can ask her to try to investigate.
Let me know.
Marco
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Marco,
Please do. Any information would be welcome and a picture would be wonderful. Thanks!
John
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ok, jhon, I'll do , but I guess it will request a long time . The world of Vatican is difficult , is not easy "move" in it.
Marco
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That's the impression I got from Marcus Junkelmann. It's about the only institution in Italy more difficult to deal with than the National Archaeological Museum of Naples, with whom he also had to deal.
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sadly bad news, Jhon . I have moved friends of mine inside the Vatican, and seems that they never had neither gladiatoral helmets nor other weapons. If that was in Castel Sant' Angelo , it must belong to some other.
Without more informations about the helmet we can lose tracks.
Marco
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Quote:sadly bad news, Jhon . I have moved friends of mine inside the Vatican, and seems that they never had neither gladiatoral helmets nor other weapons.
Too bad. Hope we will trace this helmet some day. Another problem is that it could be misinterpreted as not being 'gladiatoral'. (So it could be listed as just 'roman', I guess) But nonetheless, too bad your friends weren't able to give any new light on this helmet.
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Thanks for the effort, Marcos. I suppose it may have been on loan from Naples or from a private collection. Still, Junkelmann has it listed in his book.
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Quote:Thanks for the effort, Marcos. I suppose it may have ben on loan from Napes or from a private collection. Still, Junkelmann has it listed in his book.
I have not that book , are there some pics of the helmet in it?
Marco
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No, he lists it among the known gladiatorial helmets, but he wasn't able to get a picture of it.
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